> You said "outside of business," and then gave three examples of _asking for money_. You could have said "in dating," or "in electoral politics, No, I didn't:

> You said "outside of business," and then gave three examples of _asking for money_. You could have said "in dating," or "in electoral politics, No, I didn't: the third item I listed was "it's important for individuals who want to improve their lives (even in relationships)." Relationships include both romantic and friendship. The second item with non-profits also mentioned recruiting volunteers, not just fundraising. >"but even in those examples, "persuasive" speech verges on "coercive" speech. Persuasive speech includes: if I ask a friend to hang out with me and go to a conference, it's great for the both of us because we'll both enjoy it together and learn. There's no threat or coercion here, it's a win-win that is communicated well. The non-persuasive alternative would be: "There's a professional event this Thursday, we should go" with no further explanation. > "In a darwinian competition, eg "the marketplace of ideas," ethics will always lose out to money. To play is to lose." Ethics has value in many contexts. Certain non-profits can struggle to raise money due to having a bad reputation. Significant ethical misconduct can lead to scandals and arrests of executives. Highly unethical companies end up paying premiums to applicants due to struggles with recruiting.