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Imagine we'd had the internet for a century ... Sixty years ago it would have been a Commie flagging button. Forty years ago it would have been a button to fl

by cstross 15y ago

Imagine we'd had the internet for a century ... Sixty years ago it would have been a Commie flagging button. Forty years ago it would have been a button to flag a Dirty Hippy. Twenty years ago it'd have been a Denounce-a-Doper button. Alarmist politicians: bringing you a different instance of the same buggy social design pattern since 500BC.

noonespecial 15y ago
Let's just skip right to the "children report your parents for unpatriotic speech" button and be done with it.
nobody314159265 15y ago
It would be easier if there was a set of easily identifiable colored icons so you could click and report someone for being a terrorist, homosexual, gypsy, jew. Is there any sort of existing standard ?
- lutorm 15y ago
  There is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_concentration_camp_badges http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_concentration_camp_badges (I assume that's what you were referring to.) Edit: There's nothing like a tour of a place like Dachau to put these things in perspective. I wouldn't say I "recommend" it, because it was one of the least uplifting things I've done, but it's certainly educational.
  - dholowiski 15y ago
    We should all print out copies of that and mail them to him.
    - gyardley 15y ago
      Senator Lieberman's Internet policy might be a little goofy, but I'm pretty sure you don't need to educate him about the Holocaust.
      - thwarted 15y ago
        That may very well be, but then what's his excuse for his goofy policies on Internet policing where people are encouraged to label their fellow citizens? Being able to flag "inappropriate content" is one thing, being able to flag a blog as "terrorist" is another.
    - johncoltrane 15y ago
      Every human above the age of five who lives or has been educated in "the west" or "the north" knows at least the basics about concentration camps and the jewish genocide or what it's like to live under dictatorship. Every single one of us knows how horrible it was. None of us would want to be a victim or a witness or an actor of such a monstrosity. But it happened again and it will happen again because there have been, there are and there will always be sociopathic leaders who don't give a fuck how many people they crush on their way to power. They know full well the hows and whys of previous genocides and wasteful wars, they know lots of people suffered but they also know that some people benefited — at least for a while — from all this misery. They did/do/will seriously consider chasing down minorities, limiting free speech, blocking scientific research, declaring wars. As long as they get some benefit. As long as they aren't on the wrong side of the stick.
      - nobody314159265 15y ago
        "the jewish genocide" But how many know about any other victims? When church leaders in the US talk about removing homosexuals from the community, or councils in the UK evict gypsies - do they get the hint?
        johncoltrane 15y ago
        Do you ask if those church leaders and councils (everywhere, not only in the UK) are able to link their decisions/ideas to past horrors? Of course they do. And they rationalize the hell out of it by talking convincingly about a greater good or whatever. And by choosing helpless/"immoral" victims. And it works. Obviously.
      - lutorm 15y ago
        Every human above the age of five who lives or has been educated in "the west" or "the north" knows at least the basics about concentration camps and the jewish genocide or what it's like to live under dictatorship. Every single one of us knows how horrible it was. None of us would want to be a victim or a witness or an actor of such a monstrosity. I disagree. The resurgence of neo-Nazi movements and Holocaust denial suggests that your argument is incorrect.
  - kailashbadu 15y ago
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwins_law http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwins_law
    - Lost_BiomedE 15y ago
      Yes, sometimes it is a good thing that it is mentioned, though. I don't think it is a path that we want to go down again, slowly or quickly.
    - brc 15y ago
      I think the Godwins law thing has worn itself out now. We can't develop a history blank hole because it becomes the party/war/leader who must not be mentioned. The law is a fight against argument ad hitlerum, not against talking about the nazis.
- brc 15y ago
  Some type of 'AddThis' style plugin I'm guessing. It's all jokes but you can seriously see how government control over something as mundane as browser standards could go horribly wrong.
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
- lutorm 15y ago
  There are oppressive dictatorships of every political persuasion. It's really quite uncorrelated with what their professed ideology is. I'm willing to bet none of the people who would have been flagged with the hypothetical commie button would have been engaged in killing of political prisoners. (Besides, there's http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attica_Prison_riot http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attica_Prison_riot. Granted, the scale is different, but it's not like you need to be a communist dictatorship to engage in bloody suppression of prison uprisings.)

by cstross 15y ago

noonespecial 15y ago

Let's just skip right to the "children report your parents for unpatriotic speech" button and be done with it.

nobody314159265 15y ago

It would be easier if there was a set of easily identifiable colored icons so you could click and report someone for being a terrorist, homosexual, gypsy, jew. Is there any sort of existing standard ?

lutorm 15y ago
There is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_concentration_camp_badges http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_concentration_camp_badges (I assume that's what you were referring to.) Edit: There's nothing like a tour of a place like Dachau to put these things in perspective. I wouldn't say I "recommend" it, because it was one of the least uplifting things I've done, but it's certainly educational.
- dholowiski 15y ago
  We should all print out copies of that and mail them to him.
  - gyardley 15y ago
    Senator Lieberman's Internet policy might be a little goofy, but I'm pretty sure you don't need to educate him about the Holocaust.
    - thwarted 15y ago
      That may very well be, but then what's his excuse for his goofy policies on Internet policing where people are encouraged to label their fellow citizens? Being able to flag "inappropriate content" is one thing, being able to flag a blog as "terrorist" is another.
  - johncoltrane 15y ago
    Every human above the age of five who lives or has been educated in "the west" or "the north" knows at least the basics about concentration camps and the jewish genocide or what it's like to live under dictatorship. Every single one of us knows how horrible it was. None of us would want to be a victim or a witness or an actor of such a monstrosity. But it happened again and it will happen again because there have been, there are and there will always be sociopathic leaders who don't give a fuck how many people they crush on their way to power. They know full well the hows and whys of previous genocides and wasteful wars, they know lots of people suffered but they also know that some people benefited — at least for a while — from all this misery. They did/do/will seriously consider chasing down minorities, limiting free speech, blocking scientific research, declaring wars. As long as they get some benefit. As long as they aren't on the wrong side of the stick.
    - nobody314159265 15y ago
      "the jewish genocide" But how many know about any other victims? When church leaders in the US talk about removing homosexuals from the community, or councils in the UK evict gypsies - do they get the hint?
      - johncoltrane 15y ago
        Do you ask if those church leaders and councils (everywhere, not only in the UK) are able to link their decisions/ideas to past horrors? Of course they do. And they rationalize the hell out of it by talking convincingly about a greater good or whatever. And by choosing helpless/"immoral" victims. And it works. Obviously.
    - lutorm 15y ago
      Every human above the age of five who lives or has been educated in "the west" or "the north" knows at least the basics about concentration camps and the jewish genocide or what it's like to live under dictatorship. Every single one of us knows how horrible it was. None of us would want to be a victim or a witness or an actor of such a monstrosity. I disagree. The resurgence of neo-Nazi movements and Holocaust denial suggests that your argument is incorrect.
- kailashbadu 15y ago
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwins_law http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwins_law
  - Lost_BiomedE 15y ago
    Yes, sometimes it is a good thing that it is mentioned, though. I don't think it is a path that we want to go down again, slowly or quickly.
  - brc 15y ago
    I think the Godwins law thing has worn itself out now. We can't develop a history blank hole because it becomes the party/war/leader who must not be mentioned. The law is a fight against argument ad hitlerum, not against talking about the nazis.
brc 15y ago
Some type of 'AddThis' style plugin I'm guessing. It's all jokes but you can seriously see how government control over something as mundane as browser standards could go horribly wrong.

deleted 15y ago

[deleted]

lutorm 15y ago
There are oppressive dictatorships of every political persuasion. It's really quite uncorrelated with what their professed ideology is. I'm willing to bet none of the people who would have been flagged with the hypothetical commie button would have been engaged in killing of political prisoners. (Besides, there's http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attica_Prison_riot http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attica_Prison_riot. Granted, the scale is different, but it's not like you need to be a communist dictatorship to engage in bloody suppression of prison uprisings.)