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They have been kicked out of China. Most went to the US, some went to other places in central Asia (e.g. Kazakhstan) but they largely left for the US. And some

They have been kicked out of China. Most went to the US, some went to other places in central Asia (e.g. Kazakhstan) but they largely left for the US. And some later left central Asia after causing various local blackouts and contributing nothing to their host country other than small bribes and sucking up energy subsidies.

Victerius 4y ago
You gotta admire the Chinese bureaucracy for not using kid's gloves when dealing with a problem. In the U.S. you would have miners suing the government, or the government suing the miners, the legality of crypto mining would make its way through the court system and eventually reach the Supreme Court. Then you would have governors possibly standing up to the federal government to retain their miners. In China, the government can decide overnight to kick crypto miners to the curb. No lawsuits, no court cases, no grand speeches, just an enforcement action without possibility of recourse.
- cronix 4y ago
  Then why are their economy and financial sectors sinking so fast? Can't they just order it corrected?
  - kennend3 4y ago
    https://statisticstimes.com/economy/united-states-vs-china-economy.php https://statisticstimes.com/economy/united-states-vs-china-e... if you look carefully, you can see that based on PPP China has overtaken the US. You may also notice that the US is the one on the downtrend? Most countries have had serious economic and financial issues over the last few years.
  - GekkePrutser 4y ago
    They can, and they have. China has been building ghost cities for years to prop up their own capital figures, all those apartments would be on the books for prices no Chinese could afford, and stayed empty for years. It seems to have worked out for them and eventually the cities became inhabited. But it was a huge gamble and here in the west we would call it a scam. Of course one thing you can't fake is international currency when trading with other countries. But this is one thing China has more than enough of because we all pay them to make our goods.
    - effie 4y ago
      That may be the biggest "fake it till you make it" operation in history...
- xoa 4y ago
  >You gotta admire the Chinese bureaucracy for not using kid's gloves when dealing with a problem Do you feel the same way when the "problem" is "people who want a say in government" or "student activists" or "Uyghurs" and "dealing" with it involves genocide? It's true that authoritarian countries can act decisively on real problems sometimes, when their own private politics align. But they far more regularly act "decisively" to make things worse, to crush freedoms, to cover up their own corruption, etc. It's not particularly admirable that once in a while they have good issues too.
  - suoduandao2 4y ago
    >they far more regularly act "decisively" to make things worse, to crush freedoms, to cover up their own corruption, etc. That's why Democracy is the worst form of government excluding the alternatives. But it would be nice to have a democratic government that is also capable of acting decisively. I don't have any ideas how you'd do that, but it doesn't seem wrong to express the desire.
    - effie 4y ago
      This would be possible only when all in the parliament would agree and want the same policy and same law as soon as possible. This is indeed rare, even in dire circumstances like hospitals full of sick people and more coming, or energy crisis in Europe. Democracy being swift like autocracy is basically impossible. Any pretense of democratic government action needs the discussion to happen, which takes lots of time, and this makes the action not swift. Instead, the way western governments seem to approach these crises is that lawful process is violated by the government more or less, tough dubious measures are introduced more or less in the interest of the country, then some people protest, maybe lawsuits get filed, then justice system gets bogged down for years, and in some cases we get rulings that government broke the law. This usually changes nothing.
- rglover 4y ago
  Yeah, that's not a good thing.
- SteveNuts 4y ago
  That doesn't sound one bit admirable to me.
- saiya-jin 4y ago
  You admire how dictatorship ignores any law when its convenient for them. You realize this goes hand in hand with overall situation in China re uighurs concentration camps, useless lockdowns killing people in situation where rest of the world goes meh, supporting russia despite sanctions and so on and on. No, I dont admire them. That government has earned 0 respect, despite some hard numbers they can achieve (or not, who knows)
- jjulius 4y ago
  >In China, the government can decide overnight to kick crypto miners to the curb. No lawsuits, no court cases, no grand speeches, just an enforcement action without possibility of recourse. That's called "authoritarianism".
- justapassenger 4y ago
  Yeah, you could admire it, if they take actions you support. What when they take actions that you not only don’t support, but they impact you and your livelihood? With the same level of not using kids gloves? Cryptocurrency is a cancerous scam that needs to die. But I want to give them same due process rights as any other activity.
  - Victerius 4y ago
    I stand by what I said.
  - lmm 4y ago
    Individuals and partnerships deserve due process rights; limited-liability corporations do not.
  - kennend3 4y ago
    > Cryptocurrency is a cancerous scam that needs to die. But I want to give them same due process rights as any other activity. This doesn't make sense. You want it to die, which is done via LAWS. Yet you complain about the laws passed by the Chinese government to kill it? https://fortune.com/2022/01/04/crypto-banned-china-other-countries/ https://fortune.com/2022/01/04/crypto-banned-china-other-cou... China isn't alone in banning it, and the US COULD ban it as well (similar to how gold was banned in the past). They not only choose not to, but it is rapidly becoming "financialized" - Trading on the CME, and the major players on wall street looking to get into the game and collect their "rent".
    - justapassenger 4y ago
      There’s a big difference in passing laws by authoritarian government vs laws passed by democratic government. Try protesting and legally challenging laws in both cases as infringing on your rights.
      - kennend3 4y ago
        i think you forgot to add "communist" in your response. Normally people like to write "authoritarian communist government" to make it sound really bad. So like the people of China want crypto banned, and the government does it and this is BAD. whereas the rest of the world adds fuel to this ponzi scheme and this is good? Tell us, when the US outlawed ownership of gold under executive order 6102 was this "authoritarian" because it is unclear that the people voted on it or asked for it?

Victerius 4y ago

You gotta admire the Chinese bureaucracy for not using kid's gloves when dealing with a problem. In the U.S. you would have miners suing the government, or the government suing the miners, the legality of crypto mining would make its way through the court system and eventually reach the Supreme Court. Then you would have governors possibly standing up to the federal government to retain their miners. In China, the government can decide overnight to kick crypto miners to the curb. No lawsuits, no court cases, no grand speeches, just an enforcement action without possibility of recourse.

cronix 4y ago
Then why are their economy and financial sectors sinking so fast? Can't they just order it corrected?
- kennend3 4y ago
  https://statisticstimes.com/economy/united-states-vs-china-economy.php https://statisticstimes.com/economy/united-states-vs-china-e... if you look carefully, you can see that based on PPP China has overtaken the US. You may also notice that the US is the one on the downtrend? Most countries have had serious economic and financial issues over the last few years.
- GekkePrutser 4y ago
  They can, and they have. China has been building ghost cities for years to prop up their own capital figures, all those apartments would be on the books for prices no Chinese could afford, and stayed empty for years. It seems to have worked out for them and eventually the cities became inhabited. But it was a huge gamble and here in the west we would call it a scam. Of course one thing you can't fake is international currency when trading with other countries. But this is one thing China has more than enough of because we all pay them to make our goods.
  - effie 4y ago
    That may be the biggest "fake it till you make it" operation in history...
xoa 4y ago
>You gotta admire the Chinese bureaucracy for not using kid's gloves when dealing with a problem Do you feel the same way when the "problem" is "people who want a say in government" or "student activists" or "Uyghurs" and "dealing" with it involves genocide? It's true that authoritarian countries can act decisively on real problems sometimes, when their own private politics align. But they far more regularly act "decisively" to make things worse, to crush freedoms, to cover up their own corruption, etc. It's not particularly admirable that once in a while they have good issues too.
- suoduandao2 4y ago
  >they far more regularly act "decisively" to make things worse, to crush freedoms, to cover up their own corruption, etc. That's why Democracy is the worst form of government excluding the alternatives. But it would be nice to have a democratic government that is also capable of acting decisively. I don't have any ideas how you'd do that, but it doesn't seem wrong to express the desire.
  - effie 4y ago
    This would be possible only when all in the parliament would agree and want the same policy and same law as soon as possible. This is indeed rare, even in dire circumstances like hospitals full of sick people and more coming, or energy crisis in Europe. Democracy being swift like autocracy is basically impossible. Any pretense of democratic government action needs the discussion to happen, which takes lots of time, and this makes the action not swift. Instead, the way western governments seem to approach these crises is that lawful process is violated by the government more or less, tough dubious measures are introduced more or less in the interest of the country, then some people protest, maybe lawsuits get filed, then justice system gets bogged down for years, and in some cases we get rulings that government broke the law. This usually changes nothing.
rglover 4y ago
Yeah, that's not a good thing.
SteveNuts 4y ago
That doesn't sound one bit admirable to me.
saiya-jin 4y ago
You admire how dictatorship ignores any law when its convenient for them. You realize this goes hand in hand with overall situation in China re uighurs concentration camps, useless lockdowns killing people in situation where rest of the world goes meh, supporting russia despite sanctions and so on and on. No, I dont admire them. That government has earned 0 respect, despite some hard numbers they can achieve (or not, who knows)
jjulius 4y ago
>In China, the government can decide overnight to kick crypto miners to the curb. No lawsuits, no court cases, no grand speeches, just an enforcement action without possibility of recourse. That's called "authoritarianism".
justapassenger 4y ago
Yeah, you could admire it, if they take actions you support. What when they take actions that you not only don’t support, but they impact you and your livelihood? With the same level of not using kids gloves? Cryptocurrency is a cancerous scam that needs to die. But I want to give them same due process rights as any other activity.
- Victerius 4y ago
  I stand by what I said.
- lmm 4y ago
  Individuals and partnerships deserve due process rights; limited-liability corporations do not.
- kennend3 4y ago
  > Cryptocurrency is a cancerous scam that needs to die. But I want to give them same due process rights as any other activity. This doesn't make sense. You want it to die, which is done via LAWS. Yet you complain about the laws passed by the Chinese government to kill it? https://fortune.com/2022/01/04/crypto-banned-china-other-countries/ https://fortune.com/2022/01/04/crypto-banned-china-other-cou... China isn't alone in banning it, and the US COULD ban it as well (similar to how gold was banned in the past). They not only choose not to, but it is rapidly becoming "financialized" - Trading on the CME, and the major players on wall street looking to get into the game and collect their "rent".
  - justapassenger 4y ago
    There’s a big difference in passing laws by authoritarian government vs laws passed by democratic government. Try protesting and legally challenging laws in both cases as infringing on your rights.
    - kennend3 4y ago
      i think you forgot to add "communist" in your response. Normally people like to write "authoritarian communist government" to make it sound really bad. So like the people of China want crypto banned, and the government does it and this is BAD. whereas the rest of the world adds fuel to this ponzi scheme and this is good? Tell us, when the US outlawed ownership of gold under executive order 6102 was this "authoritarian" because it is unclear that the people voted on it or asked for it?