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People are already tired, but there’s simply not enough of them to effect any change. Especially when opposing large, well funded lobbies that are de facto writ

by mtsr 4y ago

People are already tired, but there’s simply not enough of them to effect any change. Especially when opposing large, well funded lobbies that are de facto writing the relevant laws in the US and EU. I don’t know how we’re going to be able to change this. I’ve voted for parties that are the most outspoken on this issue all my life. But somehow this never makes it into any actual policy. I’ve even on multiple occasions called my representatives as parts of grass roots lobbies against new trade agreements or laws that would set us back even further. But even when such grass roots campaigns were successful, the same proposal would just return at most a few years later and the grass roots oppositions would get tired of trying to stop them. What else can we do?

SQueeeeeL 4y ago
>What else can we do? Unironically, learn about the theory of politics and organize with others. The current political system will always act in the interest of business, it's basically an evolutionary system. There is never going to be a financial insensitive to change how copyright law works because it makes companies a lot of money, and if one representative attempts to change the law, these companies can use that wealth to sponsor a challenger to that individual (most likely in the primaries for their next race). It's dangerous to actively put any policy in place which goes against the interest of industry. But it isn't impossible, remember the government broke up Standard Oil, ultimately they do have the power to change laws if the political will is there.
- autoexec 4y ago
  > But it isn't impossible, remember the government broke up Standard Oil, ultimately they do have the power to change laws if the political will is there. I can't confidently say that you're wrong and that such change is impossible (I honestly don't know and have made the choice to be optimistic), but I think it's fair to say that our political system and the environment it operates in has changed dramatically since 1911. Many of the changes we've seen since then were orchestrated by industry with the specific goal of limiting the possibility or effectiveness of the government interfering in their activities. The brake up of Standard Oil, or even Ma Bell, may not be a very good indicator of what is possible today.
  - SQueeeeeL 4y ago
    Doomerism will always get us nowhere and is a tool of those who benefit from the status quo. Being optimistic and seeing a different future from that of today is a useful action towards achieving those goals, even if it may seem difficult. The political circumstances of an entire nation can change in a few days.
sdoering 4y ago
> What else can we do? Basically nothing. We are living in a simulation of "rule of the people". But the system is built so that basically nothing changes for those with actual power. Call my a disillusioned cynic but I believe democracy is the theatrical play that is being performed to make us believe we have some bit of influence. > But even when such grass roots campaigns were successful, the same proposal would just return at most a few years later and the grass roots oppositions would get tired of trying to stop them. If such things succeed they are an anomaly and the system over time evolves to find ways to ensure this firm of influence from the popolus will cease to exist. The current iteration you describe is crude but effective. My idealistic heart would love for a way out that actually had a chance of success, but I just can't see it.
- xallarap 4y ago
- mordae 4y ago
  You are right. The only way is to get rich and buy your own politicians or perhaps crowdfund.
  - cardanome 4y ago
    In the process of getting rich you will one day discover that your interests align now with those you once opposed as you are now part of the club. Welcome to the ruling class! (That is if you even get the chance to make it up.) As for crowdfunding, the wealth distribution is such that even if the bottom 50 percent of the population in the US all united, they could be outspend by the top one percent 16 times overs. On a global scale it is even worse.

by mtsr 4y ago

SQueeeeeL 4y ago

>What else can we do? Unironically, learn about the theory of politics and organize with others. The current political system will always act in the interest of business, it's basically an evolutionary system. There is never going to be a financial insensitive to change how copyright law works because it makes companies a lot of money, and if one representative attempts to change the law, these companies can use that wealth to sponsor a challenger to that individual (most likely in the primaries for their next race). It's dangerous to actively put any policy in place which goes against the interest of industry. But it isn't impossible, remember the government broke up Standard Oil, ultimately they do have the power to change laws if the political will is there.

autoexec 4y ago
> But it isn't impossible, remember the government broke up Standard Oil, ultimately they do have the power to change laws if the political will is there. I can't confidently say that you're wrong and that such change is impossible (I honestly don't know and have made the choice to be optimistic), but I think it's fair to say that our political system and the environment it operates in has changed dramatically since 1911. Many of the changes we've seen since then were orchestrated by industry with the specific goal of limiting the possibility or effectiveness of the government interfering in their activities. The brake up of Standard Oil, or even Ma Bell, may not be a very good indicator of what is possible today.
- SQueeeeeL 4y ago
  Doomerism will always get us nowhere and is a tool of those who benefit from the status quo. Being optimistic and seeing a different future from that of today is a useful action towards achieving those goals, even if it may seem difficult. The political circumstances of an entire nation can change in a few days.

sdoering 4y ago

> What else can we do? Basically nothing. We are living in a simulation of "rule of the people". But the system is built so that basically nothing changes for those with actual power. Call my a disillusioned cynic but I believe democracy is the theatrical play that is being performed to make us believe we have some bit of influence. > But even when such grass roots campaigns were successful, the same proposal would just return at most a few years later and the grass roots oppositions would get tired of trying to stop them. If such things succeed they are an anomaly and the system over time evolves to find ways to ensure this firm of influence from the popolus will cease to exist. The current iteration you describe is crude but effective. My idealistic heart would love for a way out that actually had a chance of success, but I just can't see it.

xallarap 4y ago
mordae 4y ago
You are right. The only way is to get rich and buy your own politicians or perhaps crowdfund.
- cardanome 4y ago
  In the process of getting rich you will one day discover that your interests align now with those you once opposed as you are now part of the club. Welcome to the ruling class! (That is if you even get the chance to make it up.) As for crowdfunding, the wealth distribution is such that even if the bottom 50 percent of the population in the US all united, they could be outspend by the top one percent 16 times overs. On a global scale it is even worse.