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>I think it's an okay fit for fleet vehicles This is the thing... there is no "one size fits all" but the nay sayers look at hydrogen and say "nah too hard for

>I think it's an okay fit for fleet vehicles This is the thing... there is no "one size fits all" but the nay sayers look at hydrogen and say "nah too hard for anything". They're wrong. Hydrogen will be huge in the NEAR future... it just wont be a silver bullet.

panick21_ 4y ago
> will be huge in the NEAR future. Is what fans of hydrogen have been arguing for 30 years.
- senectus1 4y ago
  while the dominant powers in the world get fat and rich (and sick) off liquid dino's. The world finally has motivation to get out of that rut. Dominant powers will make hydrogen work for them because thats how a corrupt capitalist society works.
manholio 4y ago
You are ignoring economies of scale and the externalities of a mass market technology. Electricity is everywhere and even so, electric cars had and still have a huge barrier to overcome in providing adequate infrastructure. Once a technology takes off, it's virtually impossible for an incumbent to replace it unless it provides drastic improvements, because of the momentum the old technology has. Well, H2 is an "also ran" at this point: it has lower energy efficiency (losing the majority of input energy in the cycle from electrolysis -> compression -> fuel cell -> electric), it requires more expensive and practically non-existent infrastructure, it's theoretical range advantages are negated by the need to have a small COPV bomb on board, forcing the longest range Hidrogen cars have less range than the equivalent electric, they are more expensive and complex, requiring expensive, platinum based catalysts, pushing the prices of H2 models into a multiple over the equivalent BEV. There is nothing that H2 can do that BEV can't do better, with the exception of fast refueling, which is becoming less and less of an issue. For cars the race with BEV is irredeemably lost, and even for trucks the hydrogen industry needs to perform some technological miracle to stay in the game.
zionic 4y ago
Hydrogen vehicles are essentially an oil company scam. They are fraud, at a physics level, vs EVs. They fall apart the second you take a serious, first-principles look at how they work. HN rate limits my replies you can read my sibling comment if you’d like more information.
- senectus1 4y ago
  this is a deeply cynical and irresponsible statement. granted, most of it is made via non-renewable dirty methods... but there is VAST sums of money pouring into Green Hydrogen. Its going to become dominant in very few years. 5-8 is my guess.

panick21_ 4y ago

> will be huge in the NEAR future. Is what fans of hydrogen have been arguing for 30 years.

senectus1 4y ago
while the dominant powers in the world get fat and rich (and sick) off liquid dino's. The world finally has motivation to get out of that rut. Dominant powers will make hydrogen work for them because thats how a corrupt capitalist society works.

manholio 4y ago

You are ignoring economies of scale and the externalities of a mass market technology. Electricity is everywhere and even so, electric cars had and still have a huge barrier to overcome in providing adequate infrastructure. Once a technology takes off, it's virtually impossible for an incumbent to replace it unless it provides drastic improvements, because of the momentum the old technology has. Well, H2 is an "also ran" at this point: it has lower energy efficiency (losing the majority of input energy in the cycle from electrolysis -> compression -> fuel cell -> electric), it requires more expensive and practically non-existent infrastructure, it's theoretical range advantages are negated by the need to have a small COPV bomb on board, forcing the longest range Hidrogen cars have less range than the equivalent electric, they are more expensive and complex, requiring expensive, platinum based catalysts, pushing the prices of H2 models into a multiple over the equivalent BEV. There is nothing that H2 can do that BEV can't do better, with the exception of fast refueling, which is becoming less and less of an issue. For cars the race with BEV is irredeemably lost, and even for trucks the hydrogen industry needs to perform some technological miracle to stay in the game.

zionic 4y ago

Hydrogen vehicles are essentially an oil company scam. They are fraud, at a physics level, vs EVs. They fall apart the second you take a serious, first-principles look at how they work. HN rate limits my replies you can read my sibling comment if you’d like more information.

senectus1 4y ago
this is a deeply cynical and irresponsible statement. granted, most of it is made via non-renewable dirty methods... but there is VAST sums of money pouring into Green Hydrogen. Its going to become dominant in very few years. 5-8 is my guess.