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I expect they will acknowledge the Pick OS? "a demand-paged, multiuser, virtual memory, time-sharing computer operating system based around a MultiValue databas

by fernly 4y ago

I expect they will acknowledge the Pick OS? "a demand-paged, multiuser, virtual memory, time-sharing computer operating system based around a MultiValue database." [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pick_operating_system https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pick_operating_system

jacknews 4y ago
"Pick was originally implemented as the Generalized Information Retrieval Language System (GIRLS) on an IBM System/360 in 1965 by Don Nelson and Richard (Dick) Pick" I'm sot sure the acronym would stand today, nor indeed Richard Pick's nickname.
skissane 4y ago
Pick's "multi-value database" is essentially just a flat-file database. I don't see how – if we put aside the marketing – it was really any more "database-oriented" than your average mainframe/minicomputer operating system with a record-oriented filesystem, such as MVS (especially VSAM), VM/CMS, OpenVMS (in particular its Files-11 RMS component), etc.
- Cupertino95014 4y ago
  From my (very dim) memory, Pick was popular because it did everything some users needed and was easy to use (relatively speaking). I never met anyone who used it, though.
  - skissane 4y ago
    It was built on BASIC – and it really took off at a time (late 1970s / early 1980s) when BASIC was still a very major programming language. I think its database features have been somewhat overhyped – but no doubt an area of strength when compared to other lower-end systems of the same time period. The fact that the OS, programming language and database were all a single software package, developed together and sold as a unit, attracted people. Much of its initial success was also due to its marketing strategy – target ISVs who would resell it as the basis of turnkey solutions. It was based on a virtual machine, which made it easy to port to disparate hardware platforms – everything from PCs, to multiple incompatible minicomputer lines, to IBM mainframes – a key selling point in its day – although not a unique approach (see UCSD Pascal). Other approaches to portability – such as the C programming language – hadn't really taken off yet.
    - jasonwatkinspdx 4y ago
      I used one of the more modern Pick variants (D3) at job during the first internet bubble. It did support a SQL query syntax, which I think makes it distinct from MVS et all. In any case its much lauded nesting feature in practice just ends up being a different way to do joins, and not particularly superior as I recall.
      - skissane 4y ago
        > It did support a SQL query syntax, which I think makes it distinct from MVS SQL query support wasn’t added to PICK platforms until the 1990s or thereabouts - at least 10 years after SQL became available on MVS (via DB2, Oracle, etc)
nivethan 4y ago
Yuuup. I currently work on multivalue systems and it is quite fun to think about an alternate reality where pick popped off instead of Linux and sql. Though I do think we are in the better timeline today. If anyone wants to try out universe which is one of the truly more modern multivalue database, I wrote an installation guide. https://nivethan.dev/devlog/installing-universe.html https://nivethan.dev/devlog/installing-universe.html

by fernly 4y ago

jacknews 4y ago

"Pick was originally implemented as the Generalized Information Retrieval Language System (GIRLS) on an IBM System/360 in 1965 by Don Nelson and Richard (Dick) Pick" I'm sot sure the acronym would stand today, nor indeed Richard Pick's nickname.

skissane 4y ago

Pick's "multi-value database" is essentially just a flat-file database. I don't see how – if we put aside the marketing – it was really any more "database-oriented" than your average mainframe/minicomputer operating system with a record-oriented filesystem, such as MVS (especially VSAM), VM/CMS, OpenVMS (in particular its Files-11 RMS component), etc.

Cupertino95014 4y ago
From my (very dim) memory, Pick was popular because it did everything some users needed and was easy to use (relatively speaking). I never met anyone who used it, though.
- skissane 4y ago
  It was built on BASIC – and it really took off at a time (late 1970s / early 1980s) when BASIC was still a very major programming language. I think its database features have been somewhat overhyped – but no doubt an area of strength when compared to other lower-end systems of the same time period. The fact that the OS, programming language and database were all a single software package, developed together and sold as a unit, attracted people. Much of its initial success was also due to its marketing strategy – target ISVs who would resell it as the basis of turnkey solutions. It was based on a virtual machine, which made it easy to port to disparate hardware platforms – everything from PCs, to multiple incompatible minicomputer lines, to IBM mainframes – a key selling point in its day – although not a unique approach (see UCSD Pascal). Other approaches to portability – such as the C programming language – hadn't really taken off yet.
  - jasonwatkinspdx 4y ago
    I used one of the more modern Pick variants (D3) at job during the first internet bubble. It did support a SQL query syntax, which I think makes it distinct from MVS et all. In any case its much lauded nesting feature in practice just ends up being a different way to do joins, and not particularly superior as I recall.
    - skissane 4y ago
      > It did support a SQL query syntax, which I think makes it distinct from MVS SQL query support wasn’t added to PICK platforms until the 1990s or thereabouts - at least 10 years after SQL became available on MVS (via DB2, Oracle, etc)

nivethan 4y ago

Yuuup. I currently work on multivalue systems and it is quite fun to think about an alternate reality where pick popped off instead of Linux and sql. Though I do think we are in the better timeline today. If anyone wants to try out universe which is one of the truly more modern multivalue database, I wrote an installation guide. https://nivethan.dev/devlog/installing-universe.html https://nivethan.dev/devlog/installing-universe.html