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> We have a probation period to work out if they’ve over-promised That's what contracting is for and I tell everybody to turn down any position that starts as

> We have a probation period to work out if they’ve over-promised That's what contracting is for and I tell everybody to turn down any position that starts as a "contractor". Commit or GTFO, stop wasting peoples time.

PebblesHD 4y ago
That’s just not the case in the Australian market. Contractors generally receive a higher rate of pay in exchange for an ongoing risk that they won’t be renewed, and are generally used to fill temporary skills gaps for projects and such. Permanent roles are expected to be for ongoing work, but that still leaves a risk of a bad hire as our labour laws are quite strict in terms of how you can terminate a permanent employee, which is what our probation laws cover, as it encourages employers to take risks with potentially under qualified candidates or be less prone to these sorts of 20 hour long 10 stage interviews to eliminate the possibility of a bad hire at the expense of wasting countless hours for even a good hire. On the balance, I prefer the probation approach as it makes life easier for everyone.
PainfullyNormal 4y ago
I disagree. Some of my best jobs were contract to hire positions. The interviews are much more humane because the company isn't so worried about making a hiring mistake. I don't know why, but something about "not renewing a contract" makes HR and the C-Suite at most companies feel a lot safer than "we're firing you" despite the fact they're virtually identical with the standard US at-will employment contract.
sofixa 4y ago
Read OPs comment again, they're in Australia, so you should not apply out of place American logic and labour "laws". Probationary periods are a normal part of employment contracts in most developed/Western countries, with few glaring exceptions like the US, due to the presence of worker protection laws like the fact you can't be fired on a whim, and you can't quit on a whim without notice. So the probationary period leaves both parties the opportunity to quit before it becomes hard to do so.

PebblesHD 4y ago

That’s just not the case in the Australian market. Contractors generally receive a higher rate of pay in exchange for an ongoing risk that they won’t be renewed, and are generally used to fill temporary skills gaps for projects and such. Permanent roles are expected to be for ongoing work, but that still leaves a risk of a bad hire as our labour laws are quite strict in terms of how you can terminate a permanent employee, which is what our probation laws cover, as it encourages employers to take risks with potentially under qualified candidates or be less prone to these sorts of 20 hour long 10 stage interviews to eliminate the possibility of a bad hire at the expense of wasting countless hours for even a good hire. On the balance, I prefer the probation approach as it makes life easier for everyone.

PainfullyNormal 4y ago

I disagree. Some of my best jobs were contract to hire positions. The interviews are much more humane because the company isn't so worried about making a hiring mistake. I don't know why, but something about "not renewing a contract" makes HR and the C-Suite at most companies feel a lot safer than "we're firing you" despite the fact they're virtually identical with the standard US at-will employment contract.

sofixa 4y ago

Read OPs comment again, they're in Australia, so you should not apply out of place American logic and labour "laws". Probationary periods are a normal part of employment contracts in most developed/Western countries, with few glaring exceptions like the US, due to the presence of worker protection laws like the fact you can't be fired on a whim, and you can't quit on a whim without notice. So the probationary period leaves both parties the opportunity to quit before it becomes hard to do so.