4 ms·

Actually most of the people I hear that talk about Teacher's union are expressing negative opinions of them, citing things like rubber rooms, and the impossibil

Actually most of the people I hear that talk about Teacher's union are expressing negative opinions of them, citing things like rubber rooms, and the impossibility of getting rid of bad teachers. Not necessarily saying I have an issue with unions per se, but the two unions I hear people complaining about the most are the teachers and the police unions. It seems generally people don't like public sector unions from the people I've talked to.

sophacles 4y ago
Those examples sound to me like great examples of unions doing thier job: protecting their members. All the places that I've heard of that weaken or eliniate various unions in the name of protecting the powerful shortly produce stories of ever increasing demands for unpaid work and firings for not doing the unpaid work, or firings/censures/punishments for not violating the laws of physics (e.g. my friend who was given a pay cut because every teacher was required to do an hour of 1:1 time with each of their students each week, but her band was 200+ kids).
- macinjosh 4y ago
  > (e.g. my friend who was given a pay cut because every teacher was required to do an hour of 1:1 time with each of their students each week, but her band was 200+ kids). Sounds like only one side of the story to me and highly improbable.
  - sophacles 4y ago
    You think its improbable that an organization would set an unmeetable KPI to have an excuse for lowering pay?
    - xboxnolifes 4y ago
      I think it's improbable that an org would set such a blatantly unreachable KPI. It's not subtle in any way and would not hold up to challenging.
- inglor_cz 4y ago
  Can't you see the problem with protecting at least the cops against things such as public scrutiny? They wield enormous power already, they should be held accountable.
bsder 4y ago
Because that all fits the anti-union PR. The mere presence of the union suddenly cuts down on the shittiness of the administration. Teachers stop getting jerked between classes and classrooms. Teachers can't get forced into doing extracurricular activities. etc. The union also pays the legal bills when teachers get sued by idiotic parents because they had the temerity to teach evolutionary theory in a science class. And, as I have pointed out previously, a lot of the "can't get rid of teachers" is due to the fact that the administration simply won't file the paperwork to get a teacher fired. You see, if you file the paperwork, that becomes a record and can wind up public information. That record is likely to come up when the administrator is trying to get a promotion or a new job. So, rather than creating a paper trail to fire the teacher, these administrators would rather transfer teachers to a "rubber room" and bury the problem so that it won't haunt the administrator's promotions in the future.

sophacles 4y ago

Those examples sound to me like great examples of unions doing thier job: protecting their members. All the places that I've heard of that weaken or eliniate various unions in the name of protecting the powerful shortly produce stories of ever increasing demands for unpaid work and firings for not doing the unpaid work, or firings/censures/punishments for not violating the laws of physics (e.g. my friend who was given a pay cut because every teacher was required to do an hour of 1:1 time with each of their students each week, but her band was 200+ kids).

macinjosh 4y ago
> (e.g. my friend who was given a pay cut because every teacher was required to do an hour of 1:1 time with each of their students each week, but her band was 200+ kids). Sounds like only one side of the story to me and highly improbable.
- sophacles 4y ago
  You think its improbable that an organization would set an unmeetable KPI to have an excuse for lowering pay?
  - xboxnolifes 4y ago
    I think it's improbable that an org would set such a blatantly unreachable KPI. It's not subtle in any way and would not hold up to challenging.
inglor_cz 4y ago
Can't you see the problem with protecting at least the cops against things such as public scrutiny? They wield enormous power already, they should be held accountable.

bsder 4y ago

Because that all fits the anti-union PR. The mere presence of the union suddenly cuts down on the shittiness of the administration. Teachers stop getting jerked between classes and classrooms. Teachers can't get forced into doing extracurricular activities. etc. The union also pays the legal bills when teachers get sued by idiotic parents because they had the temerity to teach evolutionary theory in a science class. And, as I have pointed out previously, a lot of the "can't get rid of teachers" is due to the fact that the administration simply won't file the paperwork to get a teacher fired. You see, if you file the paperwork, that becomes a record and can wind up public information. That record is likely to come up when the administrator is trying to get a promotion or a new job. So, rather than creating a paper trail to fire the teacher, these administrators would rather transfer teachers to a "rubber room" and bury the problem so that it won't haunt the administrator's promotions in the future.