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I think you are overthinking it. In Russia there is a strong tradition of writing "either good or none" about deceased people. Individual blogs and anonymous te

I think you are overthinking it. In Russia there is a strong tradition of writing "either good or none" about deceased people. Individual blogs and anonymous telegram channels are an exception, of course, but not state media. Jumping on the graves publicly just didn't catch up yet. If Kuchma, the creator of modern Ukrainian state, would die tomorrow he would get a very similar obituary, no doubt. Also, RT in general is not the crazy propaganda outlet. Its mission is to be boring and predictable. Russia has some dedicated resources for crazier kinds of propaganda.

Normille 4y ago
>I think you are overthinking it. Possibly. But isn't there also a tradition [also seen in China] where, faced with high levels of state censorship, the press turns to historical or mythological figures to make allegorical comment on current events, that they can't express openly? >In Russia there is a strong tradition of writing "either good or none" about deceased people... We have the same concept in English. The saying is "Don't speak ill of the dead" But the obituary does make a lot of criticisms of Gorbachev's failings, as well as praising his successes. Having read it all the way through [and it's a lengthy piece!] I'm left with the message "He did some great things and he did some stupid things. But his heart was in the right place and he was a was basically a decent human being" Almost the last line in the obit recounts how Gorbachev choked up and left the stage in tears halfway through singing an old Russian song in memory of his dead wife. Somehow I can't but see that as a pointed contrast with Vladimir Putin who would never allow himself to be portrayed as the kind of man who cries in public.
- thriftwy 4y ago
  The problem is, you can write virtually everything on the anonymous Telegram channels, so there is no much sense in trying to make allegorical comments on the news outlets. Nobody goes to news outlets for news anymore. They exist just to show the official stance (pretty much everywhere). Putin cried in public after his re-election in 2012 :)
NoPie 4y ago
Of course, they are writing good things about deceased. But what kind of good things? Mentioning 15,000 killed in Afghanistan is quite daring at this time. I remember Afghanistan very well because I lived in the Soviet Union at that time. Every mother was worried that her son could be sent to Afghanistan and die there. But now about three times more Russians have been killed in Ukraine (and population of Russia is about half of the population of the Soviet Union at that time). Comparatively the death rate is 6 times greater in this unwinnable war. Whatever were Gorbachev's aims, he gets credit for stopping this blood-bath. I wonder if there will be another leader emerging in Russia who will stop the pointless war in Ukraine?
- thriftwy 4y ago
  The population of Crimea, which is a part of Russian Federation that Ukraine does not acknowledge, is around 2,5M which is ~150 times greater than Soviet loss of life in Afghanistan. I'm not sure what is the way out of "pointless war in Ukraine" that would resolve this specific question, at the very least.
  - NoPie 4y ago
    Loss? People changing countries is not loss of lives. Not even remotely so. The way out is very simple – the war can be stopped in the same way as in Afghanistan.
    - thriftwy 4y ago
      In Afghanistan, Soviet Union has left behind an allied secular government which would outlive the USSR by a few years. It was not like the American disengagement with people falling off planes. If people changing countries is not a big deal, why does not Ukraine admit the loss of territories it does not control since 2014? Until that happens, or Russia is defeated militarily, I see no grounds in expecting the war to stop. Ceasefires are possible but those won't last forever either.
      - trasz 4y ago

Normille 4y ago

>I think you are overthinking it. Possibly. But isn't there also a tradition [also seen in China] where, faced with high levels of state censorship, the press turns to historical or mythological figures to make allegorical comment on current events, that they can't express openly? >In Russia there is a strong tradition of writing "either good or none" about deceased people... We have the same concept in English. The saying is "Don't speak ill of the dead" But the obituary does make a lot of criticisms of Gorbachev's failings, as well as praising his successes. Having read it all the way through [and it's a lengthy piece!] I'm left with the message "He did some great things and he did some stupid things. But his heart was in the right place and he was a was basically a decent human being" Almost the last line in the obit recounts how Gorbachev choked up and left the stage in tears halfway through singing an old Russian song in memory of his dead wife. Somehow I can't but see that as a pointed contrast with Vladimir Putin who would never allow himself to be portrayed as the kind of man who cries in public.

thriftwy 4y ago
The problem is, you can write virtually everything on the anonymous Telegram channels, so there is no much sense in trying to make allegorical comments on the news outlets. Nobody goes to news outlets for news anymore. They exist just to show the official stance (pretty much everywhere). Putin cried in public after his re-election in 2012 :)

NoPie 4y ago

Of course, they are writing good things about deceased. But what kind of good things? Mentioning 15,000 killed in Afghanistan is quite daring at this time. I remember Afghanistan very well because I lived in the Soviet Union at that time. Every mother was worried that her son could be sent to Afghanistan and die there. But now about three times more Russians have been killed in Ukraine (and population of Russia is about half of the population of the Soviet Union at that time). Comparatively the death rate is 6 times greater in this unwinnable war. Whatever were Gorbachev's aims, he gets credit for stopping this blood-bath. I wonder if there will be another leader emerging in Russia who will stop the pointless war in Ukraine?

thriftwy 4y ago
The population of Crimea, which is a part of Russian Federation that Ukraine does not acknowledge, is around 2,5M which is ~150 times greater than Soviet loss of life in Afghanistan. I'm not sure what is the way out of "pointless war in Ukraine" that would resolve this specific question, at the very least.
- NoPie 4y ago
  Loss? People changing countries is not loss of lives. Not even remotely so. The way out is very simple – the war can be stopped in the same way as in Afghanistan.
  - thriftwy 4y ago
    In Afghanistan, Soviet Union has left behind an allied secular government which would outlive the USSR by a few years. It was not like the American disengagement with people falling off planes. If people changing countries is not a big deal, why does not Ukraine admit the loss of territories it does not control since 2014? Until that happens, or Russia is defeated militarily, I see no grounds in expecting the war to stop. Ceasefires are possible but those won't last forever either.
    - trasz 4y ago