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Yes. That's how it's worked for the ~7 years I worked for myself. I'm currently working a full time remote job in addition to managing my own company, and there

Yes. That's how it's worked for the ~7 years I worked for myself. I'm currently working a full time remote job in addition to managing my own company, and there it's more like 75/25 productivity/availability. Unless I'm on call, then its flipped. If I was working retail, I suppose it'd be more like 5/95 productivity/availability.

thunky 4y ago
That's great. I commented elsehwere that I think it's all good as long as the arrangement between the employer and employee is honest. Is your full time remote employer aware that you're not really "full time"?
- grog454 4y ago
  What makes me not full time? Particularly if I'm producing the same amount as everyone else? The teams I work with span 9 timezones collectively, and that's when they're not traveling.
  - thunky 4y ago
    > What makes me not full time? Because "full time" measures time, not productivity: From Google: occupying or using the whole of the usual working day or week From Merriam-Webster: the amount of time considered the normal or standard amount for working during a given period From Oxford: for all the hours of a week during which people normally work or study, rather than just for a part of it The only way this is a problem is if you think you're getting paid by your output and your employer thinks they're paying you for your (full) time. The easy way to test if this is to check with your employer to make sure they know you actually work 10 to 30 hrs per week and the rest of the time you're on call. If they know and they're good with it, then great there's no problem. If you're not comfortable telling them then that's a problem. In that case you would effectively be a "mouse jiggler".
    - grog454 4y ago
      My employer collects "screen time" based metrics and working hours aren't part of my employment agreement. This is beside the point. Let's look at it another way. Why do you think someone who spends a majority of their assigned working hours eating, shitting, and flirting with the receptionist should earn the same compensation as someone who spends 100% of their working hours doing things that are the in their job description? When I was naive, I tolerated being the latter in a job with many of the former. This was a contributing factor in deciding to work for myself. Now, if you want me to produce more than my coworkers that's fine, but I'll have to be compensated more.
      - thunky 4y ago
        > Why do you think someone who spends a majority of their assigned working hours eating, shitting, and flirting with the receptionist should earn the same compensation as someone who spends 100% of their working hours doing things that are the in their job description? I don't, but it doesn't matter what I think. All that matters is the agreement you have with your employer. If they trust you enough to let you judge when your weekly productivity target is reached before you pack up and go to the beach, then yeah you're golden. All I'm saying is that I believe a lot of employers actually expect 40 hours of work, so if you finish your "job" in 10 hours then they expect you to let them know so you can do something else productive for them in the remaining 30. And if you don't do that, they would consider that to be dishonest and grounds for discipline. Not saying this is your deal, just that it's a common thing. But I'm confused. Your employer collects "screen time" metrics, so they must care how much time you actually spend working. On the weeks that you only work 10 hours, how to you avoid getting flagged?
        grog454 4y ago
        > But I'm confused. Your employer collects "screen time" metrics, so they must care how much time you actually spend working. This conclusion doesn't follow. I don't know what they do with them, for which employees, and under what circumstances.

thunky 4y ago

That's great. I commented elsehwere that I think it's all good as long as the arrangement between the employer and employee is honest. Is your full time remote employer aware that you're not really "full time"?

grog454 4y ago
What makes me not full time? Particularly if I'm producing the same amount as everyone else? The teams I work with span 9 timezones collectively, and that's when they're not traveling.
- thunky 4y ago
  > What makes me not full time? Because "full time" measures time, not productivity: From Google: occupying or using the whole of the usual working day or week From Merriam-Webster: the amount of time considered the normal or standard amount for working during a given period From Oxford: for all the hours of a week during which people normally work or study, rather than just for a part of it The only way this is a problem is if you think you're getting paid by your output and your employer thinks they're paying you for your (full) time. The easy way to test if this is to check with your employer to make sure they know you actually work 10 to 30 hrs per week and the rest of the time you're on call. If they know and they're good with it, then great there's no problem. If you're not comfortable telling them then that's a problem. In that case you would effectively be a "mouse jiggler".
  - grog454 4y ago
    My employer collects "screen time" based metrics and working hours aren't part of my employment agreement. This is beside the point. Let's look at it another way. Why do you think someone who spends a majority of their assigned working hours eating, shitting, and flirting with the receptionist should earn the same compensation as someone who spends 100% of their working hours doing things that are the in their job description? When I was naive, I tolerated being the latter in a job with many of the former. This was a contributing factor in deciding to work for myself. Now, if you want me to produce more than my coworkers that's fine, but I'll have to be compensated more.
    - thunky 4y ago
      > Why do you think someone who spends a majority of their assigned working hours eating, shitting, and flirting with the receptionist should earn the same compensation as someone who spends 100% of their working hours doing things that are the in their job description? I don't, but it doesn't matter what I think. All that matters is the agreement you have with your employer. If they trust you enough to let you judge when your weekly productivity target is reached before you pack up and go to the beach, then yeah you're golden. All I'm saying is that I believe a lot of employers actually expect 40 hours of work, so if you finish your "job" in 10 hours then they expect you to let them know so you can do something else productive for them in the remaining 30. And if you don't do that, they would consider that to be dishonest and grounds for discipline. Not saying this is your deal, just that it's a common thing. But I'm confused. Your employer collects "screen time" metrics, so they must care how much time you actually spend working. On the weeks that you only work 10 hours, how to you avoid getting flagged?
      - grog454 4y ago
        > But I'm confused. Your employer collects "screen time" metrics, so they must care how much time you actually spend working. This conclusion doesn't follow. I don't know what they do with them, for which employees, and under what circumstances.