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I'm firmly of the opinion that kids are naturally born geniuses, and that our [lack of] child-rearing and educational systems traumatizes them into dullards bef

I'm firmly of the opinion that kids are naturally born geniuses, and that our [lack of] child-rearing and educational systems traumatizes them into dullards before they get a chance to grow into their full potential. Clearly, it's possible to do much better than the status quo, E.g.: "Squeak Etoys, Children & Learning", Alan Kay > The projects developed in Squeak use a different and simpler kind of incremental mathematics that allows very young children to understand some of the key ideas in calculus. We have found that more than 90% of 5th graders not only understand “Galilean gravity” but are able to derive the mathematical “formulas” (actually 2nd order differential equations) using this alternative mathematics, and author a simulation that matches up very well with the experimental data. http://www.vpri.org/pdf/rn2005001_learning.pdf http://www.vpri.org/pdf/rn2005001_learning.pdf Or László Polgár > László Polgár (born 11 May 1946) is a Hungarian chess teacher and educational psychologist. He is the father of the famous Polgár sisters: Zsuzsa, Zsófia, and Judit, whom he raised to be chess prodigies, with Judit and Zsuzsa becoming the best and second-best female chess players in the world, respectively. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A1szl%C3%B3_Polg%C3%A1r https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A1szl%C3%B3_Polg%C3%A1r

jayant_kaushik 4y ago
Just read the wiki. What a great inspiration Mr. Polgar. I have quiet a few nephew and nieces (all below 10) and that allows me to see the pattern. I see that we need to create a list of skills that a kid should know by a certain age and teach them- it sky rockets their level of confidence and they are able to achieve more faster in any sphere of life. Specialising in a few areas sounds good and till now I have thought about making my kids specialise in astronomy as I think by the time they turn 20, we would have landed on Mars and lots of ISS and talented people would be required to run them / go there. The second option is - AI ( but don’t know if we attain AGI, would the world need any talent in this space) So yes, I think about fatherhood even though I’m not there yet. Talking about education system, it’s we the people who have created it to outsource the job of rearing the kid to the schools. So they can learn the skills demanded by the world to survive. We do that to focus on our career, dreams, or just to chill. And schools are doing a terrible job world over. In
ellyagg 4y ago
Probably true. My daughter finished 2nd grade behind in math and with a deep dread of it. I had been too busy to realize what was happening. So I bought the California Common Core books for 3rd grade to understand the requirements. In our 10 minute car rides to and from camp every day, I was able to teach her all of it, without books or writing anything down. The way they teach this in schools is just so far from optimial it's heartbreaking. To give one concrete example, a huge part of 3rd grade here is memorizing the times and divide tables. After some quick experiments, it was obvious that all she'd need to do was learn to count each number series, which is MUCH easier than memorizing flashcards, and can be done anywhere. Once you can count the number series, times and divide problems fall out naturally with practically no memorization needed. The second big thing this year is word problems for those math facts. These word problems are so easy if you give the child the vocabulary and concepts to break them down in into their key parts. Instead, schools just leave it up to the courage and interest of the student to keep hitting their heads against the wall. We're on to 4th grade math now and she's a week into 4th grade. I'm keen to check the Alan Kay link. :)
- boppo1 4y ago
  >learn to count each number series, which is MUCH easier than memorizing flashcards, and can be done anywhere. Once you can count the number series, times and divide problems fall out naturally Can you describe this process a little more clearly?
  - ciphol 4y ago
    I'm guessing - instead of memorizing "7*9=63" (and numerous other products), you memorize that the multiples of 9 are "9,18,27,36,45,54,63..." and the 7th one in that list is the one you want?
    - hinkley 4y ago
      And pick whichever one comes to mind easier. I am generally very good at taking tests but that was learned behavior. My origin story was a conversation about timed math tests with multiplication tables, and I was hit with the twin observations that you don’t have to do the answers in order, and if you can’t recall 7x9 but you can recall 9x7 it’s the same answer. All of a sudden I wanted to know what other tricks there were and boy did I look for all of them.
tpmx 4y ago
Are dogs also naturally born geniuses and its our lack of pup-rearing and educational systems that traumatizes them into dullards before they get a chance to grow into their full potential?
- oblak 4y ago
  Unlikely, though dogs can appear stupid due to being dogs, hence having different drives in life. This may apply to anything besides dogs.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
stephendause 4y ago
> I'm firmly of the opinion that kids are naturally born geniuses Do you mean that, relative to kids' intelligence today, everyone could do a lot better but not necessarily equally better? Or do you mean that everyone is born with roughly the same ability and that only some people succeed due to our child-rearing and educational systems?
- carapace 4y ago
  Both. I don't actually know, of course, and there are obviously people who are born idiots, or savants, or both, eh? But generally speaking, yes, every more-or-less normal child could do a lot better. Could they all do equally better? Is everyone born with roughly the same ability? I believe so for two reasons: First, the ability to learn new abilities is the defining characteristic of being a human being. Humans are universal learners in the same way that Turing Machines are universal machines. So yeah, it seems to me that any human should be able to learn to do anything any other human can do (modulus raw physical parameters, of course. But even there there's a lot of flexibility.) Second, I believe that the spark of genius is a metaphysical or spiritual thing that is universally available to all people, you just have to learn how to "tap into it". Since genius is not intrinsic to the individual (no more than gravity or the Sun) we all have equal access to it, although not all of us realize it or make use of it in our daily lives.
annyeonghada 4y ago
>I'm firmly of the opinion that kids are naturally born geniuses Well, your opinion goes against the basics of genetics and reality. >and that our [lack of] child-rearing and educational systems traumatizes them into dullards before they get a chance to grow into their full potential. Incredible how that only some people get to be traumatized and others do perfectly fine. >László Polgár What is never mentioned in László Polgár's story is that he made the sister choose the activity they already enjoyed and were good at (natural talent, in other words), and by doing that he completely invalidates the results he would have liked to obtain: I bet that if he were to force the sister to study Physics or Chemistry or Literature or whatever he would have not achieved the same "extraordinary" results.

jayant_kaushik 4y ago

Just read the wiki. What a great inspiration Mr. Polgar. I have quiet a few nephew and nieces (all below 10) and that allows me to see the pattern. I see that we need to create a list of skills that a kid should know by a certain age and teach them- it sky rockets their level of confidence and they are able to achieve more faster in any sphere of life. Specialising in a few areas sounds good and till now I have thought about making my kids specialise in astronomy as I think by the time they turn 20, we would have landed on Mars and lots of ISS and talented people would be required to run them / go there. The second option is - AI ( but don’t know if we attain AGI, would the world need any talent in this space) So yes, I think about fatherhood even though I’m not there yet. Talking about education system, it’s we the people who have created it to outsource the job of rearing the kid to the schools. So they can learn the skills demanded by the world to survive. We do that to focus on our career, dreams, or just to chill. And schools are doing a terrible job world over. In

ellyagg 4y ago

Probably true. My daughter finished 2nd grade behind in math and with a deep dread of it. I had been too busy to realize what was happening. So I bought the California Common Core books for 3rd grade to understand the requirements. In our 10 minute car rides to and from camp every day, I was able to teach her all of it, without books or writing anything down. The way they teach this in schools is just so far from optimial it's heartbreaking. To give one concrete example, a huge part of 3rd grade here is memorizing the times and divide tables. After some quick experiments, it was obvious that all she'd need to do was learn to count each number series, which is MUCH easier than memorizing flashcards, and can be done anywhere. Once you can count the number series, times and divide problems fall out naturally with practically no memorization needed. The second big thing this year is word problems for those math facts. These word problems are so easy if you give the child the vocabulary and concepts to break them down in into their key parts. Instead, schools just leave it up to the courage and interest of the student to keep hitting their heads against the wall. We're on to 4th grade math now and she's a week into 4th grade. I'm keen to check the Alan Kay link. :)

boppo1 4y ago
>learn to count each number series, which is MUCH easier than memorizing flashcards, and can be done anywhere. Once you can count the number series, times and divide problems fall out naturally Can you describe this process a little more clearly?
- ciphol 4y ago
  I'm guessing - instead of memorizing "7*9=63" (and numerous other products), you memorize that the multiples of 9 are "9,18,27,36,45,54,63..." and the 7th one in that list is the one you want?
  - hinkley 4y ago
    And pick whichever one comes to mind easier. I am generally very good at taking tests but that was learned behavior. My origin story was a conversation about timed math tests with multiplication tables, and I was hit with the twin observations that you don’t have to do the answers in order, and if you can’t recall 7x9 but you can recall 9x7 it’s the same answer. All of a sudden I wanted to know what other tricks there were and boy did I look for all of them.

tpmx 4y ago

Are dogs also naturally born geniuses and its our lack of pup-rearing and educational systems that traumatizes them into dullards before they get a chance to grow into their full potential?

oblak 4y ago
Unlikely, though dogs can appear stupid due to being dogs, hence having different drives in life. This may apply to anything besides dogs.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]

stephendause 4y ago

> I'm firmly of the opinion that kids are naturally born geniuses Do you mean that, relative to kids' intelligence today, everyone could do a lot better but not necessarily equally better? Or do you mean that everyone is born with roughly the same ability and that only some people succeed due to our child-rearing and educational systems?

carapace 4y ago
Both. I don't actually know, of course, and there are obviously people who are born idiots, or savants, or both, eh? But generally speaking, yes, every more-or-less normal child could do a lot better. Could they all do equally better? Is everyone born with roughly the same ability? I believe so for two reasons: First, the ability to learn new abilities is the defining characteristic of being a human being. Humans are universal learners in the same way that Turing Machines are universal machines. So yeah, it seems to me that any human should be able to learn to do anything any other human can do (modulus raw physical parameters, of course. But even there there's a lot of flexibility.) Second, I believe that the spark of genius is a metaphysical or spiritual thing that is universally available to all people, you just have to learn how to "tap into it". Since genius is not intrinsic to the individual (no more than gravity or the Sun) we all have equal access to it, although not all of us realize it or make use of it in our daily lives.

annyeonghada 4y ago

>I'm firmly of the opinion that kids are naturally born geniuses Well, your opinion goes against the basics of genetics and reality. >and that our [lack of] child-rearing and educational systems traumatizes them into dullards before they get a chance to grow into their full potential. Incredible how that only some people get to be traumatized and others do perfectly fine. >László Polgár What is never mentioned in László Polgár's story is that he made the sister choose the activity they already enjoyed and were good at (natural talent, in other words), and by doing that he completely invalidates the results he would have liked to obtain: I bet that if he were to force the sister to study Physics or Chemistry or Literature or whatever he would have not achieved the same "extraordinary" results.