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> The U.S. put its thumb heavily on the scale More than a thumb. The Constitution of Japan was written by Americans. America stomped on the scale, and that

> The U.S. put its thumb heavily on the scale More than a thumb. The Constitution of Japan was written by Americans. America stomped on the scale, and that time it seems to have worked.

agumonkey 4y ago
isn't it cultural ? japanese seems to be ok struggling under american control and keep reaching higher. People say US money made Japan thrive but so many time throwing money at a large problem fails.. I think the population was just more mentally compatible. Or maybe the post soviet Russia was dealt a bad hand. Hard to know (just like here, you can find infinite streams of contradictory arguments)
- MichaelCollins 4y ago
  Hard to say. I suspect the horrific bombing of Japanese cities probably had something to do with their willingness to submit. Leaving their Emperor intact as a figurehead probably helped a lot. Perhaps American willingness to help Japan rebuild immediately after such a bitter war also played a role. There were probably innumerable factors that went into it. But there are a lot of differences between that situation and the fall of the Soviet Union.
  - AnimalMuppet 4y ago
    Chief among them is, the US did not conquer or occupy the USSR. We had definite say in Japan (and West Germany). We didn't in the USSR.
    - DubiousPusher 4y ago
      That's a good point. America had some influence and backed Yeltsin to the hilt but he outflanked Gorbachev in the end and I'm not sure if that could've been changed.
  - throwaway0a5e 4y ago
    WW2 was the culmination of Japan's semi-conscious effort to speed run the transition from feudal backwater to first rate world power. Considering all the stuff they had pulled off up until that point and that they exited WW2 with their national identity and power structures intact I don't think it's that surprising that they pulled off the transition from imperial government to constitutional democracy with an imperial figurehead.
  - fomine3 4y ago
    Korean war is a big reason why Japanese industries revived, and the US don't want let Japan poor
- bigcat12345678 4y ago
  > isn't it cultural ? On the one hand, in the scale of brutality, every nation in history is at least 1 level below the Imperial Japan in WWII. On the other hand, after the decisive show of force, beaconed by the nuclear bomb, Japan realized that brutality is going to cause the doom of that nation. So they naturally bowed down. After that brutality is no longer necessary, like a beaten dog that would not really need a leash.
  - agumonkey 4y ago
    It's one way to see that. But after such brutal events it's easy for a people to fall into despair or hate but Japan bounce back better than a lot of country. They rapidly absorbed and mastered electronics better than a lot of country. I always find it rare.
    - bigcat12345678 4y ago
      That part thanks to confuscious tradition Look at China, Confucius is the God of Asia....
    - MichaelCollins 4y ago
      > They rapidly absorbed and mastered electronics better than a lot of country. I believe this is something they started doing before/during the war. Specifically I've heard that they started reverse engineering and producing copies of allied radio equipment during the war.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
vintermann 4y ago
But it ironically worked a lot because they pushed a constitution which looked nothing like their own.

> The U.S. put its thumb heavily on the scale More than a thumb. The Constitution of Japan was written by Americans. America stomped on the scale, and that time it seems to have worked.

agumonkey 4y ago

isn't it cultural ? japanese seems to be ok struggling under american control and keep reaching higher. People say US money made Japan thrive but so many time throwing money at a large problem fails.. I think the population was just more mentally compatible. Or maybe the post soviet Russia was dealt a bad hand. Hard to know (just like here, you can find infinite streams of contradictory arguments)

MichaelCollins 4y ago
Hard to say. I suspect the horrific bombing of Japanese cities probably had something to do with their willingness to submit. Leaving their Emperor intact as a figurehead probably helped a lot. Perhaps American willingness to help Japan rebuild immediately after such a bitter war also played a role. There were probably innumerable factors that went into it. But there are a lot of differences between that situation and the fall of the Soviet Union.
- AnimalMuppet 4y ago
  Chief among them is, the US did not conquer or occupy the USSR. We had definite say in Japan (and West Germany). We didn't in the USSR.
  - DubiousPusher 4y ago
    That's a good point. America had some influence and backed Yeltsin to the hilt but he outflanked Gorbachev in the end and I'm not sure if that could've been changed.
- throwaway0a5e 4y ago
  WW2 was the culmination of Japan's semi-conscious effort to speed run the transition from feudal backwater to first rate world power. Considering all the stuff they had pulled off up until that point and that they exited WW2 with their national identity and power structures intact I don't think it's that surprising that they pulled off the transition from imperial government to constitutional democracy with an imperial figurehead.
- fomine3 4y ago
  Korean war is a big reason why Japanese industries revived, and the US don't want let Japan poor
bigcat12345678 4y ago
> isn't it cultural ? On the one hand, in the scale of brutality, every nation in history is at least 1 level below the Imperial Japan in WWII. On the other hand, after the decisive show of force, beaconed by the nuclear bomb, Japan realized that brutality is going to cause the doom of that nation. So they naturally bowed down. After that brutality is no longer necessary, like a beaten dog that would not really need a leash.
- agumonkey 4y ago
  It's one way to see that. But after such brutal events it's easy for a people to fall into despair or hate but Japan bounce back better than a lot of country. They rapidly absorbed and mastered electronics better than a lot of country. I always find it rare.
  - bigcat12345678 4y ago
    That part thanks to confuscious tradition Look at China, Confucius is the God of Asia....
  - MichaelCollins 4y ago
    > They rapidly absorbed and mastered electronics better than a lot of country. I believe this is something they started doing before/during the war. Specifically I've heard that they started reverse engineering and producing copies of allied radio equipment during the war.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

vintermann 4y ago

But it ironically worked a lot because they pushed a constitution which looked nothing like their own.