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One wonders if the you believe the negative of this holds. If everyone believes you're an adulterer you have a responsibility to cheat on your spouse? --- In

One wonders if the you believe the negative of this holds. If everyone believes you're an adulterer you have a responsibility to cheat on your spouse? --- In addition, this is why cherry picking is frowned upon. Jon Stewart was responding to the ridiculousness of CNN, Fox, et al, running hit pieces on him, and they started running hit pieces on him because they were showing up in polls as less trustworthy than Jon Stewart. What you're basically claiming here is that because he's more trustworthy than CNN, Fox, et al, he has a responsibility to trustworthiness. AT THE TIME this was happening, the general sentiment was the opposite. That the trustworthiness of CNN, Fox, et al was SO BAD, that even a comedian, whose job it is to take things out of context and stretch the truth for a laugh, was more trustworthy than CNN, Fox, et al. This was all going on during the second Iraq war, where Bush and Cheney was giving speeches about mission accomplished atop aircraft carriers with the banner "Mission Accomplished" while we were still sending more troops. It was clearly a political maneuver and Jon Stewart was making fun of it whilst CNN, et al, were mostly not calling them out. But people aren't _stupid_, they knew it was ingenuine. That Jon Stewart, a fricking comedian, was the only public forum really highlighting how disingenuous it was is WHY he was getting voted as more trustworthy in polls. Jon Stewart was pointing this out. And you know what? The people were fucking right. When the 911 responders were getting dicked who was it that fought for them? It sure as shit wasn't CNN, Fox, et al. --- Without that context, what you're doing here is cherry picking, and I suspect it's because the current "social politics" surrounding joe rogan are causing younger people to let it bleed over onto Jon Stewart.

jrochkind1 4y ago
I'm 46. And a leftist. fwiw, btw. No, becuase someone thinks you've done something bad doesn't mean you have the have the responsibility to do something bad. I think Joe Rogan encourages people to build a worldview off of things he says, encourages people to treat him as reliable news, and profits from them doing so, both monetarily and by influence over what people think. He has a huge amount of influence over what people think, based on people believing that he's a straight shooter. Then when called on whether he's doing so responsibly, whether he really is straight-shooting, he says "I'm just an entertainer, it's not a relevant question". I think it's irresponsible and manipulative. I don't see how that has anything to do with thinking someone is obligated to kill if people believe they are a murderer, that's a ridiculous and silly analogy that just doesn't work. I think Jon Stewart did/does the same thing as Joe Rogan. He has a huge amount of influence over what people think, based on people believing that he's a straight shooter, and he likes, encourages, and profits from this trust and this influence -- it is intentional. Then when called on whether he's doing so responsibly, he says "I'm just an entertainer, you can't expect that of me or hold me accountable for it, it's not what entertainers do". I think it's irresponsible and manipulative. Can you be specific about how you think the cases differ?
- P5fRxh5kUvp2th 4y ago
  The point is that people are not obligated, period. This obligation thing is just an attempt at trying to find fault with actions that are completely reasonable. As for your question, I've already explained the context around Jon Stewart and I have no interest in a culture war.
  - jrochkind1 4y ago
    > The point is that people are not obligated, period. People? Period? If you truly don't think journalists and political leaders, among others, have a responsibility to behave responsibly with the truth and their methods, and that people are right to expect that of them and evaluate them on it... Then I guess we have enough of a different worldview that communication is indeed difficult. I'm not sure what makes something a culture war to you. I am a leftist critisizing both Joe Rogan and Jon Stewart. My problem with Jon Stewart is not with his politics, which I largely agree with. To me, a culture war approach is more thinking that you must pick a side and then insist those on the other side are without virtue and those on yours without flaw -- I am also not interested in that.
    - P5fRxh5kUvp2th 4y ago
      You've changed your stance here, before it was that someone is obligated if people believed something about them, now it's that they're obligated if they call themselves a certain thing. One almost begins to suspect this is all a front for disliking Jon Stewart ;) You have a good day.
      - jrochkind1 4y ago
        I do not in fact dislike Jon Stewart. I don't know him personally, but I am capable of critiquing people I also think have done positive things, which I think he has. It is unclear to me if you are -- that's the culture war, indeed, thinking that everyone must be either all bad or all good. I do not believe I have changed my stance at all, this is something i have spent some time thinking about and have a thing I think about it. But ok.

jrochkind1 4y ago

I'm 46. And a leftist. fwiw, btw. No, becuase someone thinks you've done something bad doesn't mean you have the have the responsibility to do something bad. I think Joe Rogan encourages people to build a worldview off of things he says, encourages people to treat him as reliable news, and profits from them doing so, both monetarily and by influence over what people think. He has a huge amount of influence over what people think, based on people believing that he's a straight shooter. Then when called on whether he's doing so responsibly, whether he really is straight-shooting, he says "I'm just an entertainer, it's not a relevant question". I think it's irresponsible and manipulative. I don't see how that has anything to do with thinking someone is obligated to kill if people believe they are a murderer, that's a ridiculous and silly analogy that just doesn't work. I think Jon Stewart did/does the same thing as Joe Rogan. He has a huge amount of influence over what people think, based on people believing that he's a straight shooter, and he likes, encourages, and profits from this trust and this influence -- it is intentional. Then when called on whether he's doing so responsibly, he says "I'm just an entertainer, you can't expect that of me or hold me accountable for it, it's not what entertainers do". I think it's irresponsible and manipulative. Can you be specific about how you think the cases differ?

P5fRxh5kUvp2th 4y ago
The point is that people are not obligated, period. This obligation thing is just an attempt at trying to find fault with actions that are completely reasonable. As for your question, I've already explained the context around Jon Stewart and I have no interest in a culture war.
- jrochkind1 4y ago
  > The point is that people are not obligated, period. People? Period? If you truly don't think journalists and political leaders, among others, have a responsibility to behave responsibly with the truth and their methods, and that people are right to expect that of them and evaluate them on it... Then I guess we have enough of a different worldview that communication is indeed difficult. I'm not sure what makes something a culture war to you. I am a leftist critisizing both Joe Rogan and Jon Stewart. My problem with Jon Stewart is not with his politics, which I largely agree with. To me, a culture war approach is more thinking that you must pick a side and then insist those on the other side are without virtue and those on yours without flaw -- I am also not interested in that.
  - P5fRxh5kUvp2th 4y ago
    You've changed your stance here, before it was that someone is obligated if people believed something about them, now it's that they're obligated if they call themselves a certain thing. One almost begins to suspect this is all a front for disliking Jon Stewart ;) You have a good day.
    - jrochkind1 4y ago
      I do not in fact dislike Jon Stewart. I don't know him personally, but I am capable of critiquing people I also think have done positive things, which I think he has. It is unclear to me if you are -- that's the culture war, indeed, thinking that everyone must be either all bad or all good. I do not believe I have changed my stance at all, this is something i have spent some time thinking about and have a thing I think about it. But ok.