5 ms·

Over time, Linux package dependencies show predator/prey relationship

52 points by codelion 15y ago

I linked to the comemnts by mistake, the link for the post is at http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2011/11/over-time-linux-package-dependencies-show-predatorprey-relationship.ars

kijin 15y ago
You linked to the comment section with the pun thread.
- pyre 15y ago
  I've noticed this recently. A fair number of ArsTechnica links have the #comment-bar anchor on the URL. It's curious.
codelion 15y ago
I linked to the comments by mistake, the link for the post is at http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2011/11/over-time-linux-package-dependencies-show-predatorprey-relationship.ars http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2011/11/over-time-linux-...
- dfc 15y ago
  I think you should still be able to edit the link.
  - codelion 15y ago
    No I am not able to edit the link, am I missing something ?
estevez 15y ago
This reminds me of the work done by Răzvan Musăloiu-E. [1], which used some visualization techniques commonly applied to genomic and phylogenetic data to examine the relationships between filesystems in the Linux kernel. [1]: http://cs.jhu.edu/~razvanm/fs-expedition/ http://cs.jhu.edu/~razvanm/fs-expedition/
jiggy2011 15y ago
I have a Love/Hate relationship with Debian/Ubuntu packages. 99% of the time it works swimmingly and is superior to any other way of installing software. Then you get a problem where you try to install something really simple like the jdee extension for emacs and you get this: Reading state information... Done Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that you have requested an impossible situation or if you are using the unstable distribution that some required packages have not yet been created or been moved out of Incoming. The following information may help to resolve the situation: The following packages have unmet dependencies. jde : Depends: cedet-contrib (>= 1:1.0pre4-2) but it is not installable Depends: cogre (>= 1:1.0pre4-2) but it is not installable Depends: eieio (>= 1:1.0pre4-2) but it is not installable Depends: semantic (>= 1:1.0pre4-2) but it is not installable Depends: speedbar (>= 1:1.0pre4-2) but it is not installable Recommends: ecb but it is not going to be installed E: Broken packages Wow great, what the hell are these packages and why the hell are they not installable? It gives me absolutely no clues whatsoever so your only options are: A) Google the error and hope that somebody has exactly the same problem with exactly the same version of the distro you are using. B) Try and compile everything from source which about 50% of the time will generate even more cryptic error messages or ask you questions you have no idea of the answer to like asking for the locations of obscure libraries and even when it does work,it will take the software outside the cozy world of apt-get management and may require you to install different versions of dependency libraries all over your home folder. C) Completely give up on the idea of installing that software. incidentally if anyone has a solution to this particular problem with jdee I'd love to know :) I don't understand how these conflicts come into existence in the first place, surely if two programs require different versions of the same library to run it should be possible to somehow install both versions and link each program to a different one?
- parfe 15y ago
  Jdee is a pile of garbage which made me quit emacs twice before finally ignoring the package altogether on my third (successful) attempt to switch. While other deb packages exhibit the same symptoms from time to time, jdee specifically doesn't surprise me. JDEE has the midas touch but instead of gold you get shit. I feel pity for the debian package maintainer attempting to salvage such a horrible mess of code. I didn't realize how angry JDEE made me. Two years passed since I tried to use it and that package can still bring out some latent rage.
101001010111 15y ago
Statically-compiled programs have no known predators. They typically die from old age.
Tobu 15y ago
Would anyone liberate the research behind this? It's obviously publicly-funded research, and I'd like to know more about what the authors mean by modularity. Also, I'm curious what they mean by the predator/prey analogy, when the populations are a binary rather than an arbitrary number of instances. [ETA] Found it: http://www.box.com/s/m0nkpxszhnccls210coe http://www.box.com/s/m0nkpxszhnccls210coe

52 points by codelion 15y ago

I linked to the comemnts by mistake, the link for the post is at http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2011/11/over-time-linux-package-dependencies-show-predatorprey-relationship.ars

kijin 15y ago

You linked to the comment section with the pun thread.

pyre 15y ago
I've noticed this recently. A fair number of ArsTechnica links have the #comment-bar anchor on the URL. It's curious.

codelion 15y ago

I linked to the comments by mistake, the link for the post is at http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2011/11/over-time-linux-package-dependencies-show-predatorprey-relationship.ars http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2011/11/over-time-linux-...

dfc 15y ago
I think you should still be able to edit the link.
- codelion 15y ago
  No I am not able to edit the link, am I missing something ?

estevez 15y ago

This reminds me of the work done by Răzvan Musăloiu-E. [1], which used some visualization techniques commonly applied to genomic and phylogenetic data to examine the relationships between filesystems in the Linux kernel. [1]: http://cs.jhu.edu/~razvanm/fs-expedition/ http://cs.jhu.edu/~razvanm/fs-expedition/

jiggy2011 15y ago

I have a Love/Hate relationship with Debian/Ubuntu packages. 99% of the time it works swimmingly and is superior to any other way of installing software. Then you get a problem where you try to install something really simple like the jdee extension for emacs and you get this: Reading state information... Done Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that you have requested an impossible situation or if you are using the unstable distribution that some required packages have not yet been created or been moved out of Incoming. The following information may help to resolve the situation: The following packages have unmet dependencies. jde : Depends: cedet-contrib (>= 1:1.0pre4-2) but it is not installable Depends: cogre (>= 1:1.0pre4-2) but it is not installable Depends: eieio (>= 1:1.0pre4-2) but it is not installable Depends: semantic (>= 1:1.0pre4-2) but it is not installable Depends: speedbar (>= 1:1.0pre4-2) but it is not installable Recommends: ecb but it is not going to be installed E: Broken packages Wow great, what the hell are these packages and why the hell are they not installable? It gives me absolutely no clues whatsoever so your only options are: A) Google the error and hope that somebody has exactly the same problem with exactly the same version of the distro you are using. B) Try and compile everything from source which about 50% of the time will generate even more cryptic error messages or ask you questions you have no idea of the answer to like asking for the locations of obscure libraries and even when it does work,it will take the software outside the cozy world of apt-get management and may require you to install different versions of dependency libraries all over your home folder. C) Completely give up on the idea of installing that software. incidentally if anyone has a solution to this particular problem with jdee I'd love to know :) I don't understand how these conflicts come into existence in the first place, surely if two programs require different versions of the same library to run it should be possible to somehow install both versions and link each program to a different one?

parfe 15y ago
Jdee is a pile of garbage which made me quit emacs twice before finally ignoring the package altogether on my third (successful) attempt to switch. While other deb packages exhibit the same symptoms from time to time, jdee specifically doesn't surprise me. JDEE has the midas touch but instead of gold you get shit. I feel pity for the debian package maintainer attempting to salvage such a horrible mess of code. I didn't realize how angry JDEE made me. Two years passed since I tried to use it and that package can still bring out some latent rage.

101001010111 15y ago

Statically-compiled programs have no known predators. They typically die from old age.

Tobu 15y ago

Would anyone liberate the research behind this? It's obviously publicly-funded research, and I'd like to know more about what the authors mean by modularity. Also, I'm curious what they mean by the predator/prey analogy, when the populations are a binary rather than an arbitrary number of instances. [ETA] Found it: http://www.box.com/s/m0nkpxszhnccls210coe http://www.box.com/s/m0nkpxszhnccls210coe