3 ms·

Germany orders Sept 1 shutdown of digital ad displays to save gas

52 points by LinuxBender 4y ago

mtmail 4y ago
Related from 3 days ago "German digital signage ban prompts confusion" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32604821 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32604821
malwrar 4y ago
This is an interesting idea! I'm not a digital signage expert, but I have done some projects with [1] and for 160mm (~6 inches) of panel you’ll draw up to 2 watts! Most digital signs I’ve seen in the wild appear to be composed of similar panels, and I’ve often marveled at how much energy they must draw (not to mention cost).
- archi42 4y ago
  Huh? Missing Link? I always thought that digital signage displays were essential TV screens optimised for always-on, maybe with an integrated (network) media player. At least that's the case for an old LG digital signage display I happen to have upstairs (got it essentially for free due to aged backlight, was used in a pharmacy). But maybe that's just outdated info on my end ;)
  - malwrar 4y ago
    Sorry, link is here: https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/adafruit-industries-llc/3649/8535238?s=N4IgjCBcoLQBxVAYygMwIYBsDOBTANCAPZQDa4ArAEwIC6AvvYVWSAMwBsALAJwgNA https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/adafruit-industri... A lot of the bigger outdoor or more distant indoor signs I’ve seen in my neck of the woods appear to basically just be a matrix of surface mount LEDs w/ a pitch juuust small enough that from a modest distance it appears to be a full picture. The LG you have is essentially the same thing obv, but if you’re mounting a sign to a building or billboard you don’t really need that pixel density and the hardware necessary to drive them.
    - archi42 4y ago
      I know the LED matrix displays you linked mostly from Festivals and from a few (3-5 I'm aware of) largish (<= 4m wide, I suspect) outdoor signs in our city. (Edit) Surprised they're more common around your place. But might just depend on region. I misunderstood that you thought mine was a LED matrix as well, but that was just my sleepy mind I think ;) still leaving the original comment below. (End edit) But there are also these: https://www.toshibatec.ch/assets/Uploads/Digital-Signage-Inform-RZ.jpg https://www.toshibatec.ch/assets/Uploads/Digital-Signage-Inf... And a bit simpler https://www.digitalsignage.de/files/digitalsignage/content/slider3/slider-digital-signage-im-handel.jpg https://www.digitalsignage.de/files/digitalsignage/content/s... They are much more common around here (200k pop city) than LED matrix displays, and often seem to run 24/7. These are essentially rugged, super bright, high-res TVs plus some PC to drive them. Maybe for larger cities with ad-heavy squares (think Time Square) these are significant consumers, but for our city I expect TV-like displays too consume more power (combined, not per-display obviously ;-)). But I suppose that bill targets both/all types anyway :)
jmugan 4y ago
It might help light pollution too.
scyzoryk_xyz 4y ago
It’s going to be a dark winter here in Europe. I’m just a bit east of Germany here in Poland: my city has already dialed down street lighting considerably. The night has become quite creepy. Wouldn’t mind digital the ad displays going away for good though.
stuaxo 4y ago
Is anything happening in the UK like this or are we doing the head in the sand technique as usual?
- polski-g 4y ago
  UK's plan is to get BTFO in the next election and the new government will drop all sanctions.
Proven 4y ago
xg15 4y ago
I can't help but feel a lot of the "discussion" around this step is FUD, likely thrown up by advertisers. Such as this one: > Invidis also pointed out that digital signage at bus stops and train stations can do double duty displaying ads and timetable information I live in Germany and travel a lot by train. You generally see a lot of public-space digital signage here: Some displays show ads and tabloid-style news bits, some are for timetables. In 30 years, I've never seen one display being used for both. That would be a pretty remarkable feat actually, as both systems are entirely separate: They use different tech and are run by different organisations. The most public-service thing the ad displays were ever employed for was to show reminders of local covid rules - and even that only because the city had commissioned a public awareness campaign. There is absolutely zero technical difficulty in shutting down the ad displays but keeping the timetable displays running.
- ZeroGravitas 4y ago
  > Further complicating matters is a requirement to turn off the screens altogether rather than leaving the displays blank. Yes, this phrase here especially sounds like it's come straight from a corporate apologist with an anti-regulation agenda.

52 points by LinuxBender 4y ago

Related from 3 days ago "German digital signage ban prompts confusion" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32604821 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32604821

malwrar 4y ago

This is an interesting idea! I'm not a digital signage expert, but I have done some projects with [1] and for 160mm (~6 inches) of panel you’ll draw up to 2 watts! Most digital signs I’ve seen in the wild appear to be composed of similar panels, and I’ve often marveled at how much energy they must draw (not to mention cost).

archi42 4y ago
Huh? Missing Link? I always thought that digital signage displays were essential TV screens optimised for always-on, maybe with an integrated (network) media player. At least that's the case for an old LG digital signage display I happen to have upstairs (got it essentially for free due to aged backlight, was used in a pharmacy). But maybe that's just outdated info on my end ;)
- malwrar 4y ago
  Sorry, link is here: https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/adafruit-industries-llc/3649/8535238?s=N4IgjCBcoLQBxVAYygMwIYBsDOBTANCAPZQDa4ArAEwIC6AvvYVWSAMwBsALAJwgNA https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/adafruit-industri... A lot of the bigger outdoor or more distant indoor signs I’ve seen in my neck of the woods appear to basically just be a matrix of surface mount LEDs w/ a pitch juuust small enough that from a modest distance it appears to be a full picture. The LG you have is essentially the same thing obv, but if you’re mounting a sign to a building or billboard you don’t really need that pixel density and the hardware necessary to drive them.
  - archi42 4y ago
    I know the LED matrix displays you linked mostly from Festivals and from a few (3-5 I'm aware of) largish (<= 4m wide, I suspect) outdoor signs in our city. (Edit) Surprised they're more common around your place. But might just depend on region. I misunderstood that you thought mine was a LED matrix as well, but that was just my sleepy mind I think ;) still leaving the original comment below. (End edit) But there are also these: https://www.toshibatec.ch/assets/Uploads/Digital-Signage-Inform-RZ.jpg https://www.toshibatec.ch/assets/Uploads/Digital-Signage-Inf... And a bit simpler https://www.digitalsignage.de/files/digitalsignage/content/slider3/slider-digital-signage-im-handel.jpg https://www.digitalsignage.de/files/digitalsignage/content/s... They are much more common around here (200k pop city) than LED matrix displays, and often seem to run 24/7. These are essentially rugged, super bright, high-res TVs plus some PC to drive them. Maybe for larger cities with ad-heavy squares (think Time Square) these are significant consumers, but for our city I expect TV-like displays too consume more power (combined, not per-display obviously ;-)). But I suppose that bill targets both/all types anyway :)

jmugan 4y ago

It might help light pollution too.

scyzoryk_xyz 4y ago

It’s going to be a dark winter here in Europe. I’m just a bit east of Germany here in Poland: my city has already dialed down street lighting considerably. The night has become quite creepy. Wouldn’t mind digital the ad displays going away for good though.

stuaxo 4y ago

Is anything happening in the UK like this or are we doing the head in the sand technique as usual?

polski-g 4y ago
UK's plan is to get BTFO in the next election and the new government will drop all sanctions.

Proven 4y ago

xg15 4y ago

I can't help but feel a lot of the "discussion" around this step is FUD, likely thrown up by advertisers. Such as this one: > Invidis also pointed out that digital signage at bus stops and train stations can do double duty displaying ads and timetable information I live in Germany and travel a lot by train. You generally see a lot of public-space digital signage here: Some displays show ads and tabloid-style news bits, some are for timetables. In 30 years, I've never seen one display being used for both. That would be a pretty remarkable feat actually, as both systems are entirely separate: They use different tech and are run by different organisations. The most public-service thing the ad displays were ever employed for was to show reminders of local covid rules - and even that only because the city had commissioned a public awareness campaign. There is absolutely zero technical difficulty in shutting down the ad displays but keeping the timetable displays running.

ZeroGravitas 4y ago
> Further complicating matters is a requirement to turn off the screens altogether rather than leaving the displays blank. Yes, this phrase here especially sounds like it's come straight from a corporate apologist with an anti-regulation agenda.