4 ms·

Doesn't seem to me to be any more challenging than putting a "man not-of-color,whatever-that-means" on the moon. Put a teen, on the moon. Or some other random

by Zecc 4y ago

Doesn't seem to me to be any more challenging than putting a "man not-of-color,whatever-that-means" on the moon. Put a teen, on the moon. Or some other random person without having them go through extensive training, really. I'll be more impressed.

_dain_ 4y ago
I come from a quaint society where we hire people based on their abilities and talents, and we don't announce ahead of time what sex and skin colour they're supposed to have beforehand.
- criddell 4y ago
  When you have the luxury of thousands of extraordinarily well qualified candidates you have lots of freedom to choose candidates who bring something new to the table.
  - _dain_ 4y ago
    Something new, like their skin colour? How does that actually help do a space mission better?
    - criddell 4y ago
      Think more about soft skills than hard skills. A big part of a modern astronauts job is speaking to people outside of the agency. School children, politicians, etc... It's in the agency's best interests to be relatable and inspiring to the widest swath of the population possible.
      - _dain_ 4y ago
        That's so dull and unambitious. If astronauts are celebrities it implies there aren't many of them, which implies you're not doing many missions. It's manned space travel as an expensive toy for national prestige and pork barrel spending, i.e. nothing new at all. >It's in the agency's best interests to be relatable and inspiring to the widest swath of the population possible. I mean that just says it all, doesn't it? The organization pursuing whatever will further the organization, rather than achieving the nominal mission. Thank God we have SpaceX who are actually slashing launch costs and aiming to commoditize space travel. Astronauts shouldn't be inspiring celebrities, they should be like aircraft pilots. Competent, professional, and ubiquitous.
        criddell 4y ago
        It seems like you are assuming they are selecting unqualified people to check some diversity box and as far as I know, that isn't the case at all. They have an enormous candidate pool of supremely talented people to choose from and in that pool are people of all types. But even if that weren't the case, consider that some of the people flying these days are only there because they can afford to pay for the seat. You want pilots but now that space flight is becoming more routine, you get passengers. I agree with you - thank God for SpaceX (and FWIW, they also have diversity commitments). They are an amazing partner for NASA and are making their competitors (especially Boeing) look incompetent.
- altacc 4y ago
  What annoys me about this unfortunately rather common comment is that is seems to suggest that women and people of colour could never be more qualified than 6 white men. Exceptionally qualified people get labelled as token representation, regardless of their skill set. Having said that, I consider representation to be a valid selection criteria for publicly funded mission. Representation matters and that’s something that a lot of people will never understand as they’ve been widely represented throughout history, so it’s just normal life for them. Not so for many, many other people.
  - _dain_ 4y ago
    When you've announced ahead of time that you want a woman and a black, that literally is the definition of token representation. You know what candidate pool would be even more qualified? The ones eligible based on their qualifications. By definition. I'm astounded that this open prejudice exists, and that people don't feel ashamed to defend it. It ought to get struck down by the courts. >Having said that, I consider representation to be a valid selection criteria for publicly funded mission. It's tax money spent on open, shameless racism and sexism.

by Zecc 4y ago

_dain_ 4y ago

I come from a quaint society where we hire people based on their abilities and talents, and we don't announce ahead of time what sex and skin colour they're supposed to have beforehand.

criddell 4y ago
When you have the luxury of thousands of extraordinarily well qualified candidates you have lots of freedom to choose candidates who bring something new to the table.
- _dain_ 4y ago
  Something new, like their skin colour? How does that actually help do a space mission better?
  - criddell 4y ago
    Think more about soft skills than hard skills. A big part of a modern astronauts job is speaking to people outside of the agency. School children, politicians, etc... It's in the agency's best interests to be relatable and inspiring to the widest swath of the population possible.
    - _dain_ 4y ago
      That's so dull and unambitious. If astronauts are celebrities it implies there aren't many of them, which implies you're not doing many missions. It's manned space travel as an expensive toy for national prestige and pork barrel spending, i.e. nothing new at all. >It's in the agency's best interests to be relatable and inspiring to the widest swath of the population possible. I mean that just says it all, doesn't it? The organization pursuing whatever will further the organization, rather than achieving the nominal mission. Thank God we have SpaceX who are actually slashing launch costs and aiming to commoditize space travel. Astronauts shouldn't be inspiring celebrities, they should be like aircraft pilots. Competent, professional, and ubiquitous.
      - criddell 4y ago
        It seems like you are assuming they are selecting unqualified people to check some diversity box and as far as I know, that isn't the case at all. They have an enormous candidate pool of supremely talented people to choose from and in that pool are people of all types. But even if that weren't the case, consider that some of the people flying these days are only there because they can afford to pay for the seat. You want pilots but now that space flight is becoming more routine, you get passengers. I agree with you - thank God for SpaceX (and FWIW, they also have diversity commitments). They are an amazing partner for NASA and are making their competitors (especially Boeing) look incompetent.
altacc 4y ago
What annoys me about this unfortunately rather common comment is that is seems to suggest that women and people of colour could never be more qualified than 6 white men. Exceptionally qualified people get labelled as token representation, regardless of their skill set. Having said that, I consider representation to be a valid selection criteria for publicly funded mission. Representation matters and that’s something that a lot of people will never understand as they’ve been widely represented throughout history, so it’s just normal life for them. Not so for many, many other people.
- _dain_ 4y ago
  When you've announced ahead of time that you want a woman and a black, that literally is the definition of token representation. You know what candidate pool would be even more qualified? The ones eligible based on their qualifications. By definition. I'm astounded that this open prejudice exists, and that people don't feel ashamed to defend it. It ought to get struck down by the courts. >Having said that, I consider representation to be a valid selection criteria for publicly funded mission. It's tax money spent on open, shameless racism and sexism.