4 ms·

Appeasing greed and a notion of vengeance. The Americans I personally know are quite punitive, and do believe in an eye for an eye, which is odd because they ar

Appeasing greed and a notion of vengeance. The Americans I personally know are quite punitive, and do believe in an eye for an eye, which is odd because they are also Christians (it's honestly unsurprising, they're just out of practice, I guess). Generally I wonder if people comprehend that prisons should be (for the majority of inmates) intended to reform people; that is, to make them better and show them a better path. I'm not clear how people think throwing a bunch of criminals together in a featureless pen to lift weights, fight and fraternize is going to achieve anything. If anything, these people warrant more social investment than the average person, with the intent of educating them and building honest skills in them, so that they have new opportunities that they didn't have previously, when they made their mistakes the first time around. I guess this sentiment is seen as sappy, unrealistic and saccharine, and of course socialist. Of course it has to be paired with having decent socialized healthcare and education, but I think we have seen in practice how the contemporary American school of thought for prisons does not work, and we have seen in other countries what is possible, and how reformist and sympathetic attitudes to incarceration, combined with strong social support generally can produce better outcomes in regards to crime.

DavidPeiffer 4y ago
> Generally I wonder if people comprehend that prisons should be (for the majority of inmates) intended to reform people; that is, to make them better and show them a better path. I tried bringing up this line of reasoning one time with two coworkers I was close with. Both had the attitude of "why should I be paying for these criminals to be comfortable and get an education and stuff while I'm working and supporting a family and not committing crimes". A roof over their head and 3 really basic meals per day was all they really wanted to provide. "Sit in the corner and think about what you did" is a method for punishing little kids, but my coworkers couldn't be convinced we probably need to adapt our strategies for adults.
greedo 4y ago
One of the ideals and goals of the Progressive Movement in the early 20th Century was prisoner rehabilitation. But the US is just too punitive in nature to ever want to rehabilitate prisoners. We don't want to help non-criminals, so why on Earth would we want to help those who have made mistakes? As Articbull mentioned, slavery is permitted in the Constitution for prisons. So even our noble eradication of slavery after the Civil War was incomplete. And surprise, surprise, what population group is over-represented in prison? I sent a friend a link to a YT video showing the prison conditions in Norway. He thought that was nuts. How will they learn the error of their ways if they don't suffer? Even trying to appeal to practical concerns like recidivism rates doesn't work. To the cold-hearted, that just proves that these felons are incorrigible and deserve to be locked away forever.

DavidPeiffer 4y ago

> Generally I wonder if people comprehend that prisons should be (for the majority of inmates) intended to reform people; that is, to make them better and show them a better path. I tried bringing up this line of reasoning one time with two coworkers I was close with. Both had the attitude of "why should I be paying for these criminals to be comfortable and get an education and stuff while I'm working and supporting a family and not committing crimes". A roof over their head and 3 really basic meals per day was all they really wanted to provide. "Sit in the corner and think about what you did" is a method for punishing little kids, but my coworkers couldn't be convinced we probably need to adapt our strategies for adults.

greedo 4y ago

One of the ideals and goals of the Progressive Movement in the early 20th Century was prisoner rehabilitation. But the US is just too punitive in nature to ever want to rehabilitate prisoners. We don't want to help non-criminals, so why on Earth would we want to help those who have made mistakes? As Articbull mentioned, slavery is permitted in the Constitution for prisons. So even our noble eradication of slavery after the Civil War was incomplete. And surprise, surprise, what population group is over-represented in prison? I sent a friend a link to a YT video showing the prison conditions in Norway. He thought that was nuts. How will they learn the error of their ways if they don't suffer? Even trying to appeal to practical concerns like recidivism rates doesn't work. To the cold-hearted, that just proves that these felons are incorrigible and deserve to be locked away forever.