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Psychedelics are illegal not because they create hallucinations but rather because they help break down the hallucinations we have about the world. In the land

Psychedelics are illegal not because they create hallucinations but rather because they help break down the hallucinations we have about the world. In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is a hallucinating idiot.

heavyset_go 4y ago
One of my favorite stories about psychedelic experiences is a friend's coworker dosing acid one weekend, coming back in on Monday, saying "I hate it here" and quitting on the spot. They went on to travel and start their own company, and are doing great for themselves. In my experience, psychedelics really help tear down the justifications we put up for the BS we tolerate in our daily lives and can help you connect with what you really appreciate and want in life. Definitely helped me realize the kind of person I want to be and appreciate the good things in my life. And similarly to the story about the coworker quitting, my tolerance for BS is nil, now, too.
- kirse 4y ago
  psychedelics really help tear down the justifications we put up for the BS we tolerate in our daily lives Thing is you can do that with an extended weekend of fasting/meditation and solitude in the woods. Bring a notepad and pencil if you really want to lock in the new perspective. Bonus is that fasting is also widely known to be healthy. Plus how do you really know the causative agent of change was the drugs, what if there was already the underlying emotional desire to do something and having the experience was more about creating the justification to act? Surely one of your psychedelic insights had to be how little agency we really have. We easily back-fill reasoning and stories to happenings that were bound to happen anyway. Our brains always want a story for cause and effect, but so much of what happens occurs outside of our control or awareness. It's like riding on a rollercoaster and proudly claiming "yea I decided to make it do a loop"
  - virgildotcodes 4y ago
    >what if there was already the underlying emotional desire to do something and having the experience was more about creating the justification to act? That's definitely part of it, and I think kind of what OP was alluding to in that the experience allows you to dissolve many of the cognitive habits you've built up over your life, allowing you to experience an extremely honest perception of your own mind. I'm not sure if you've tried it yourself, but I have yet to find any other way to achieve that level of clarity. I understand in theory that a lot of people find their way there by meditation, but I don't have the discipline or attention span to get there. Psychedelics are a way of making that state of being accessible to those who may lack the ability or the motivation to get there through other means. I'll also say that of those I know who partake in both, psychedelics still offer incredibly powerful and profound experiences even to those who practice meditation seriously for years or decades.
    - kirse 4y ago
      experience an extremely honest perception of your own mind. Is it though? Does walking into the fun-house mirror room really produce an accurate reflection of who you are? An altered perspective accompanied by an intense emotional experience doesn't necessarily indicate any real truth was uncovered. You can have some quite profound experiences on 3-5 day water/electrolyte fasts as well. When the body is stripped of the energy necessary to maintain psychological defense mechanisms and cognitive habits, they peel away quite well there too. Highly recommended for the time-sensitive and impatient spiritual journeyman.
      - orthecreedence 4y ago
        It seems you're badmouthing psychadelics, while advocating for achieving the same effects without the use of drugs. Why does it matter if someone has a similar experience with a different method? Also, not everyone can just hop into the woods, alone, for days on end without food. Although that sounds like fun to me, I get horrible migraines if I don't eat regularly. What then? Is vomiting up my last bit of bile huddled in excruciating pain in the middle of the woods going to be some profound experience? Possibly, but psychadelics are an easier method for someone like me (and can be just as natural, in the case of mushrooms/ayahuasca/mescaline/etc).
Bakary 4y ago
If that were true, we would likely see a greater variety of discourse and testimonies from people who use hallucinogens. On the contrary, they tend to sound surprisingly similar in terms of world-view to each other. Once you experience hallucinogens yourself, it becomes pretty clear why that might be. The obvious conclusion is, of course, that hallucinogens unlock an objective, common reality. That's not what the depth and quality of the observations produced suggest, however.
- bckr 4y ago
  This comment seems to contradict itself. Can you clarify your position?
Natsu 4y ago
I saw Ketamine remove depression immediately after a single dose in a loved one. Thought it was magic, because it was, a lifetime of depression just evaporated like nothing. But then came the psychosis. Nearly got stabbed in my sleep because a voice told them to do that. So... let's just say I think there are other explanations, too.

heavyset_go 4y ago

One of my favorite stories about psychedelic experiences is a friend's coworker dosing acid one weekend, coming back in on Monday, saying "I hate it here" and quitting on the spot. They went on to travel and start their own company, and are doing great for themselves. In my experience, psychedelics really help tear down the justifications we put up for the BS we tolerate in our daily lives and can help you connect with what you really appreciate and want in life. Definitely helped me realize the kind of person I want to be and appreciate the good things in my life. And similarly to the story about the coworker quitting, my tolerance for BS is nil, now, too.

kirse 4y ago
psychedelics really help tear down the justifications we put up for the BS we tolerate in our daily lives Thing is you can do that with an extended weekend of fasting/meditation and solitude in the woods. Bring a notepad and pencil if you really want to lock in the new perspective. Bonus is that fasting is also widely known to be healthy. Plus how do you really know the causative agent of change was the drugs, what if there was already the underlying emotional desire to do something and having the experience was more about creating the justification to act? Surely one of your psychedelic insights had to be how little agency we really have. We easily back-fill reasoning and stories to happenings that were bound to happen anyway. Our brains always want a story for cause and effect, but so much of what happens occurs outside of our control or awareness. It's like riding on a rollercoaster and proudly claiming "yea I decided to make it do a loop"
- virgildotcodes 4y ago
  >what if there was already the underlying emotional desire to do something and having the experience was more about creating the justification to act? That's definitely part of it, and I think kind of what OP was alluding to in that the experience allows you to dissolve many of the cognitive habits you've built up over your life, allowing you to experience an extremely honest perception of your own mind. I'm not sure if you've tried it yourself, but I have yet to find any other way to achieve that level of clarity. I understand in theory that a lot of people find their way there by meditation, but I don't have the discipline or attention span to get there. Psychedelics are a way of making that state of being accessible to those who may lack the ability or the motivation to get there through other means. I'll also say that of those I know who partake in both, psychedelics still offer incredibly powerful and profound experiences even to those who practice meditation seriously for years or decades.
  - kirse 4y ago
    experience an extremely honest perception of your own mind. Is it though? Does walking into the fun-house mirror room really produce an accurate reflection of who you are? An altered perspective accompanied by an intense emotional experience doesn't necessarily indicate any real truth was uncovered. You can have some quite profound experiences on 3-5 day water/electrolyte fasts as well. When the body is stripped of the energy necessary to maintain psychological defense mechanisms and cognitive habits, they peel away quite well there too. Highly recommended for the time-sensitive and impatient spiritual journeyman.
    - orthecreedence 4y ago
      It seems you're badmouthing psychadelics, while advocating for achieving the same effects without the use of drugs. Why does it matter if someone has a similar experience with a different method? Also, not everyone can just hop into the woods, alone, for days on end without food. Although that sounds like fun to me, I get horrible migraines if I don't eat regularly. What then? Is vomiting up my last bit of bile huddled in excruciating pain in the middle of the woods going to be some profound experience? Possibly, but psychadelics are an easier method for someone like me (and can be just as natural, in the case of mushrooms/ayahuasca/mescaline/etc).

Bakary 4y ago

If that were true, we would likely see a greater variety of discourse and testimonies from people who use hallucinogens. On the contrary, they tend to sound surprisingly similar in terms of world-view to each other. Once you experience hallucinogens yourself, it becomes pretty clear why that might be. The obvious conclusion is, of course, that hallucinogens unlock an objective, common reality. That's not what the depth and quality of the observations produced suggest, however.

bckr 4y ago
This comment seems to contradict itself. Can you clarify your position?

Natsu 4y ago

I saw Ketamine remove depression immediately after a single dose in a loved one. Thought it was magic, because it was, a lifetime of depression just evaporated like nothing. But then came the psychosis. Nearly got stabbed in my sleep because a voice told them to do that. So... let's just say I think there are other explanations, too.