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> The same can be said about financial sector bailouts, agricultural subsides and the outrageous 800 billions for “defense”. Cancelling student debt is a lot ch

by bko 4y ago

> The same can be said about financial sector bailouts, agricultural subsides and the outrageous 800 billions for “defense”. Cancelling student debt is a lot cheaper than the F-35 program, more democratic and has a better return in terms of welfare. The two have nothing to do with each other. I am against the financial sector bailouts as well, but it's important to note that the 2008 $700 billion bailouts were paid back >> Early estimates for the bailout's risk cost were as much as $700 billion; however, TARP recovered $441.7 billion from $426.4 billion invested, earning a $15.3 billion profit or an annualized rate of return of 0.6%, and perhaps a loss when adjusted for inflation.[3] > I am all in for a more streamlined and lean State, but until that time, I think that Raytheon stock holders and Wall Street can share a bit of the current pie with the People The people that will pay is taxpayers and consumers through higher prices. I'm fairly sure Wall Street will be fine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergency_Economic_Stabilization_Act_of_2008 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergency_Economic_Stabilizati...

PretzelPirate 4y ago
> but it's important to note that the 2008 $700 billion bailouts were paid back I’m far from an expert, but isn’t the assumption that the cost of cancelling these loans will also be paid back indirectly now that loan holders have less of a financial burden? It feels to me like giving people lower levels of debt, access to affordable education, and a social safety net to allow risk taking would improve our economy overall. Of course this isn’t what the government has provided at the moment.
- bko 4y ago
  All the supposed benefits to loans being cancelled is equally applicable to tax cuts, except it would have less unintended consequences and better targeted. The current loans are targeted to college educated young people. College is still a good investment so the benefit will skew towards relatively wealthy. > It feels to me like giving people lower levels of debt, access to affordable education, and a social safety net to allow risk taking would improve our economy overall. Of course this isn’t what the government has provided at the moment. Right. Student loan forgiveness does nothing about lowering cost of education. If anything it doubles down as people will be more willing to borrow more thinking they will get it forgiven. It also discourages others to pay back their loans. The reason schools are crazy expensive because we encourage students to take out uneconomical loans. Basically a no questions asked loan given to any 18 year old attending an accredited school. Private lenders are more discerning and will consider the cost, major and profile of the student and offer a lower rate than the federal rate for borrowers with strong profiles (e.g. going to med school vs majoring in pottery at NYU)
  - thunky 4y ago
    > All the supposed benefits to loans being cancelled is equally applicable to tax cuts, except it would have less unintended consequences and better targeted Exactly. Better yet: send every adult 10k, no qualifying criteria required. For those that pay taxes, they can think of it as a tax cut. For those that have student debt, they can think of it as debt being cancelled. For everyone else, they can think of it as cash. Or as a "dividend" a la Andrew Yang. Not saying it's a great idea, but it makes more sense than this govt unintended consequece du jour.
croes 4y ago
"Professor Deborah J. Lucas pegs the cost of the 2008-09 bailouts at $498 billion." https://mitsloan.mit.edu/ideas-made-to-matter/heres-how-much-2008-bailouts-really-cost https://mitsloan.mit.edu/ideas-made-to-matter/heres-how-much... Who paid that? >The people that will pay is taxpayers and consumers through higher prices. Are these the same taxpayers that now can't even afford cheaper prices because of the students debts or the debts of their children?
drewcoo 4y ago
> The two have nothing to do with each other. The commonality is the politicians who hand out that money. Politicians who operate on behalf of their donor class and not on behalf of the American people.

by bko 4y ago

PretzelPirate 4y ago

> but it's important to note that the 2008 $700 billion bailouts were paid back I’m far from an expert, but isn’t the assumption that the cost of cancelling these loans will also be paid back indirectly now that loan holders have less of a financial burden? It feels to me like giving people lower levels of debt, access to affordable education, and a social safety net to allow risk taking would improve our economy overall. Of course this isn’t what the government has provided at the moment.

bko 4y ago
All the supposed benefits to loans being cancelled is equally applicable to tax cuts, except it would have less unintended consequences and better targeted. The current loans are targeted to college educated young people. College is still a good investment so the benefit will skew towards relatively wealthy. > It feels to me like giving people lower levels of debt, access to affordable education, and a social safety net to allow risk taking would improve our economy overall. Of course this isn’t what the government has provided at the moment. Right. Student loan forgiveness does nothing about lowering cost of education. If anything it doubles down as people will be more willing to borrow more thinking they will get it forgiven. It also discourages others to pay back their loans. The reason schools are crazy expensive because we encourage students to take out uneconomical loans. Basically a no questions asked loan given to any 18 year old attending an accredited school. Private lenders are more discerning and will consider the cost, major and profile of the student and offer a lower rate than the federal rate for borrowers with strong profiles (e.g. going to med school vs majoring in pottery at NYU)
- thunky 4y ago
  > All the supposed benefits to loans being cancelled is equally applicable to tax cuts, except it would have less unintended consequences and better targeted Exactly. Better yet: send every adult 10k, no qualifying criteria required. For those that pay taxes, they can think of it as a tax cut. For those that have student debt, they can think of it as debt being cancelled. For everyone else, they can think of it as cash. Or as a "dividend" a la Andrew Yang. Not saying it's a great idea, but it makes more sense than this govt unintended consequece du jour.

croes 4y ago

"Professor Deborah J. Lucas pegs the cost of the 2008-09 bailouts at $498 billion." https://mitsloan.mit.edu/ideas-made-to-matter/heres-how-much-2008-bailouts-really-cost https://mitsloan.mit.edu/ideas-made-to-matter/heres-how-much... Who paid that? >The people that will pay is taxpayers and consumers through higher prices. Are these the same taxpayers that now can't even afford cheaper prices because of the students debts or the debts of their children?

drewcoo 4y ago

> The two have nothing to do with each other. The commonality is the politicians who hand out that money. Politicians who operate on behalf of their donor class and not on behalf of the American people.