7 ms·

These two papers give a much better answer than this blog: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1389041720300772 https://www.sciencedirect.com/sci

These two papers give a much better answer than this blog: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1389041720300772 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S138904172... (why do humans increase their chili consumption) and https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8042654/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8042654/ (antibacterial + disease-alleviating properties of capsaicin). Besides the fact that capsaicin has antibacterial effects and exerts indirect disease-alleviating effects during bacterial infections (something our ancestors had to deal with a lot), eating chili triggers an endorphin high, but regularly eating chili makes you less sensitive and hence you have to eat more chili to get your little high. Taken together, these two properties of chili most likely have been the main drivers of it being adopted as a staple food in many cultures.

playingalong 4y ago
> eating chili triggers an endorphin high, but regularly eating chili makes you less sensitive and hence you have to eat more chili to get your little high I wonder what is the evolutionary reason for that. The older you are, the more defense you needed against bacteria?
- short_sells_poo 4y ago
  I always thought that the endorphin high is unrelated to the beneficial effect: any strong pain is normally followed by a release of endorphins to compensate. It's why pain and pleasure are often difficult to disentangle. A strong dose of capsaicin will induce a painful sensation in the mouth (you'll feel like burning), which is compensated by a release of endorphins.
- scns 4y ago
  Taste sensitivity declines with age. Strong flavours like smelly cheese are disgusting for kids but enjoyed by older adults.
  - fauria 4y ago
    They are enjoyed by adults who acquired that taste: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acquired_taste https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acquired_taste For instance, it would be really hard to find anyone, no matter how old, who enjoys surströmming or hákarl without having become acquitted with them.
    - wizofaus 4y ago
      Acquainted :) Though perhaps they are used as part of the Swedish justice system?
- samatman 4y ago
  Biological systems seeks homeostasis on a very deep level. A lot of our brain is devoted to normalizing volume and brightness, for example. The reason chili enthusiasts need more over time is basically the same as the reason heroin enthusiasts do.
  - wizofaus 4y ago
    But our sensitivity to temperature doesn't decrease with age, if anything the opposite... even if that's more obvious with ambient rather than tactile temperature (which I'd imagine are processed quite differently by our nervous systems).
- epgui 4y ago
  The desensitization to hot peppers happens at a much smaller scale than years, so it doesn’t have much to do with your age.
jesuscript 4y ago
I’ve gotten to a point where I prefer to drink a hot spicy soup in a cup over many things. If I drink coffee, it also always burning hot with a solid mix of cream, sugar and cinnamon. One of the things it helps me achieve is a small warmth that also helps me sleep. I don’t even resort to hot sauce for the broths anymore, just cutting up one or two small chili peppers makes the soup hotter. The soups are becoming a really good diet trick because they have little to no calories (but have insane amounts of sodium). Some chicken bullion, ginger/lemon grass (paste or the real deal), chili peppers, black pepper and salt has truly started becoming my morning coffee.
- saiya-jin 4y ago
  Drinking regularly drinks that are too hot significantly increases the risk of throat cancer. I can't find the paper anymore that I read few years ago, but they did check various cultures where drinking very hot tea is traditional, controlled for other factors and the results were not nice. IIRC the threshold where risk became significantly higher was around 70-75 degrees celzius. I mean think about it - around 60 degrees C proteins are getting hammered in all cells. Doing frequent small burns in cells lining your throat damages them (also teeth), make it a habit and bad things will eventually happen. There wasn't enough time to develop protection when we moved from hunters and gatherers. That your specific brain interprets this as somehow pleasant isn't telling much, some people get off on extremely painful experiences that nobody normal considers a good idea.
  - epgui 4y ago
    Biochemist who went to med school: very hot beverages will indeed cause tissue damage, and can cause oral cancer. Though English uses the same word to describe both (“hot”), there is no relationship between “spicy” food and high temperature stuff, apart from the fact that they both stimulate pain receptors (but in very different ways, one being harmful and the other being harmless).
    - overthemoon 4y ago
      Why does tissue damage increase the risk of cancer? My guess is that more damage -> more cells created to replace damaged ones -> more opportunities for mutation. Is that right? If you bite the inside of your lip a lot, is that bad? Uh, asking for a friend.
SenHeng 4y ago
Living in Japan, it’s very hard to find properly spicy food or nice chilli sauces. I’ve resorted to just eating plain cut chilli. A while back, I experimented with not adding more spices than was already provided in my meals. No pepper, no chilli. After about a month, I started experiencing new tastes and flavours from foods I’ve always ate. It was amazing. But I craved that endorphin high from spicy foods and have fallen back to my old ways.
- bayofpigs 4y ago
- subpixel 4y ago
  One of the hottest things I've ever eaten was at a Korean-run Japanese curry house in NYC. IIRC you chose spiciness on a 1-5 scale. The first time I tried a 2 and it was damn spicy. Next time I tried a 3 and it ruined my lunch, my pride, my afternoon, and my evening.
  - resoluteteeth 4y ago
    There are plenty of curry places in Japan that do spice levels too. However normal Japanese curry tends to be pretty mild as well as other food in Japan, including Japanese style Chinese places which often serve dishes like mapo tofu with no spiciness whatsoever.
    - unsignedchar 4y ago
      There are Japanese curry places in SoCal that charge extra (~25-50c per level IIRC) per spice level. Since I couldn’t handle any more than 2/10 I found that a win-win :)
Avshalom 4y ago
Problem with this is that outside of the Americas no one was eating caspicum until about 500 years ago.
- wizofaus 4y ago
  I thought only Aussies (and Kiwis) called them that... though apparently the term is used in India and Singapore too. (Yes I know it's the correct botanical term for the plant, but we use it for the food too).

playingalong 4y ago

> eating chili triggers an endorphin high, but regularly eating chili makes you less sensitive and hence you have to eat more chili to get your little high I wonder what is the evolutionary reason for that. The older you are, the more defense you needed against bacteria?

short_sells_poo 4y ago
I always thought that the endorphin high is unrelated to the beneficial effect: any strong pain is normally followed by a release of endorphins to compensate. It's why pain and pleasure are often difficult to disentangle. A strong dose of capsaicin will induce a painful sensation in the mouth (you'll feel like burning), which is compensated by a release of endorphins.
scns 4y ago
Taste sensitivity declines with age. Strong flavours like smelly cheese are disgusting for kids but enjoyed by older adults.
- fauria 4y ago
  They are enjoyed by adults who acquired that taste: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acquired_taste https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acquired_taste For instance, it would be really hard to find anyone, no matter how old, who enjoys surströmming or hákarl without having become acquitted with them.
  - wizofaus 4y ago
    Acquainted :) Though perhaps they are used as part of the Swedish justice system?
samatman 4y ago
Biological systems seeks homeostasis on a very deep level. A lot of our brain is devoted to normalizing volume and brightness, for example. The reason chili enthusiasts need more over time is basically the same as the reason heroin enthusiasts do.
- wizofaus 4y ago
  But our sensitivity to temperature doesn't decrease with age, if anything the opposite... even if that's more obvious with ambient rather than tactile temperature (which I'd imagine are processed quite differently by our nervous systems).
epgui 4y ago
The desensitization to hot peppers happens at a much smaller scale than years, so it doesn’t have much to do with your age.

jesuscript 4y ago

I’ve gotten to a point where I prefer to drink a hot spicy soup in a cup over many things. If I drink coffee, it also always burning hot with a solid mix of cream, sugar and cinnamon. One of the things it helps me achieve is a small warmth that also helps me sleep. I don’t even resort to hot sauce for the broths anymore, just cutting up one or two small chili peppers makes the soup hotter. The soups are becoming a really good diet trick because they have little to no calories (but have insane amounts of sodium). Some chicken bullion, ginger/lemon grass (paste or the real deal), chili peppers, black pepper and salt has truly started becoming my morning coffee.

saiya-jin 4y ago
Drinking regularly drinks that are too hot significantly increases the risk of throat cancer. I can't find the paper anymore that I read few years ago, but they did check various cultures where drinking very hot tea is traditional, controlled for other factors and the results were not nice. IIRC the threshold where risk became significantly higher was around 70-75 degrees celzius. I mean think about it - around 60 degrees C proteins are getting hammered in all cells. Doing frequent small burns in cells lining your throat damages them (also teeth), make it a habit and bad things will eventually happen. There wasn't enough time to develop protection when we moved from hunters and gatherers. That your specific brain interprets this as somehow pleasant isn't telling much, some people get off on extremely painful experiences that nobody normal considers a good idea.
- epgui 4y ago
  Biochemist who went to med school: very hot beverages will indeed cause tissue damage, and can cause oral cancer. Though English uses the same word to describe both (“hot”), there is no relationship between “spicy” food and high temperature stuff, apart from the fact that they both stimulate pain receptors (but in very different ways, one being harmful and the other being harmless).
  - overthemoon 4y ago
    Why does tissue damage increase the risk of cancer? My guess is that more damage -> more cells created to replace damaged ones -> more opportunities for mutation. Is that right? If you bite the inside of your lip a lot, is that bad? Uh, asking for a friend.

SenHeng 4y ago

Living in Japan, it’s very hard to find properly spicy food or nice chilli sauces. I’ve resorted to just eating plain cut chilli. A while back, I experimented with not adding more spices than was already provided in my meals. No pepper, no chilli. After about a month, I started experiencing new tastes and flavours from foods I’ve always ate. It was amazing. But I craved that endorphin high from spicy foods and have fallen back to my old ways.

bayofpigs 4y ago
subpixel 4y ago
One of the hottest things I've ever eaten was at a Korean-run Japanese curry house in NYC. IIRC you chose spiciness on a 1-5 scale. The first time I tried a 2 and it was damn spicy. Next time I tried a 3 and it ruined my lunch, my pride, my afternoon, and my evening.
- resoluteteeth 4y ago
  There are plenty of curry places in Japan that do spice levels too. However normal Japanese curry tends to be pretty mild as well as other food in Japan, including Japanese style Chinese places which often serve dishes like mapo tofu with no spiciness whatsoever.
  - unsignedchar 4y ago
    There are Japanese curry places in SoCal that charge extra (~25-50c per level IIRC) per spice level. Since I couldn’t handle any more than 2/10 I found that a win-win :)

Avshalom 4y ago

Problem with this is that outside of the Americas no one was eating caspicum until about 500 years ago.

wizofaus 4y ago
I thought only Aussies (and Kiwis) called them that... though apparently the term is used in India and Singapore too. (Yes I know it's the correct botanical term for the plant, but we use it for the food too).