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Heating is a separate cost, rarely electric. Cooling - did you know that Germans aren’t big fans of A/C? Hot water - same as heating. Besides, in Germany we d

Heating is a separate cost, rarely electric. Cooling - did you know that Germans aren’t big fans of A/C? Hot water - same as heating. Besides, in Germany we don’t say “Car charging”, we say “eat healthy and ride your bike”.

xxs 4y ago
>Heating is a separate cost, rarely electric. Of course, geothermal pumps are still a better option than most.
- ivan_gammel 4y ago
  You can call it geothermal, when it comes from underground pipes ;) District level heating still exists in some areas, also quite often there’s a single oil or gas boiler for a multi-apartment building.
odshoifsdhfs 4y ago
With number 25 on cars per capita in the world and one of the biggest car industries and also obesity rates above average than EU. 'eat healthy and ride your bike' my ass
- ivan_gammel 4y ago
  >With number 25 on cars per capita in the world For one of the richest countries with one of the biggest car industries being only 25th is a great achievement in mobility. Yes, we could do better, but just compare it to the default country (#7 in car ownership, #2 if you exclude microstates). >obesity rates above average than EU 47th in the global ranking, after Iceland. And USA is right after Oceania. It depends on the perspective.
  - odshoifsdhfs 4y ago
    It isn't about the absolute numbers (even though they aren't 'good' for Germany specially if you remove micro/extreme poor states), is the 'holier than thou' attitude from Germans. It's like an obese person going to the morbidly obese: 'here we don't stuff our mouths with food like you' while having no sense that they are just in a slightly better state than the ones they are chastising.
    - ivan_gammel 4y ago
      I do not understand your argument. We do not use personal cars as often as USA or some other countries, instead relying more on public transportation and bikes - as a result, electricity costs for transportation are quite low for individual households. What's your point? That less than 25% of population do not eat healthy and this is somehow relevant to the conversation?
      - odshoifsdhfs 4y ago
        Among the EU, germans drive more km per car than anyone else except Austria (data from 2000, can't find newer). Among the EU, Germans rank 6th on car ownership per capita (2020 data). Going these together, and it shows within the EU, Germans are the on the top of km per capita and not 'we drive less than others' (except maybe the US) Your reply to someone asking about charging their EV(thus need to drive) was that in Germany that isn't a problem because there you eat healthy and cycle, which is a lie (you drive more than most/all of the EU). (as per cycling data, DE is 7th on daily usage of bikes in the EU, but couldn't find any data regarding number of kilometres though)
        ivan_gammel 4y ago
        Data from 2000 is missing two decades of economic growth in Eastern Europe and major EU-funded investments in infrastructure in that region. But let's assume, Germany is still high in the ranks. What does it prove? In Europe the life style from Dublin to Warsaw isn't that different: we often live in an apartment rather than in a house in suburb, we rely on public transportation and have great networks, using a bike is a norm in many cities etc. This all means that electricity budget of an individual household is unlikely to include EV charging at the moment. This will be different from USA, where having individual house and traveling by cars is often the only option. So, what's your point exactly?
        xxs 4y ago
        It's still very likely Germans drive more - Germany is very decentralized (which is amazing, e.g. no grid locks), and it has one of the best railroads in the world... still has likely one the best highways as well. The only East European country that can possible change the stats would be Poland (but personally I don't believe that) - the rest are just too small.

xxs 4y ago

>Heating is a separate cost, rarely electric. Of course, geothermal pumps are still a better option than most.

ivan_gammel 4y ago
You can call it geothermal, when it comes from underground pipes ;) District level heating still exists in some areas, also quite often there’s a single oil or gas boiler for a multi-apartment building.

odshoifsdhfs 4y ago

With number 25 on cars per capita in the world and one of the biggest car industries and also obesity rates above average than EU. 'eat healthy and ride your bike' my ass

ivan_gammel 4y ago
>With number 25 on cars per capita in the world For one of the richest countries with one of the biggest car industries being only 25th is a great achievement in mobility. Yes, we could do better, but just compare it to the default country (#7 in car ownership, #2 if you exclude microstates). >obesity rates above average than EU 47th in the global ranking, after Iceland. And USA is right after Oceania. It depends on the perspective.
- odshoifsdhfs 4y ago
  It isn't about the absolute numbers (even though they aren't 'good' for Germany specially if you remove micro/extreme poor states), is the 'holier than thou' attitude from Germans. It's like an obese person going to the morbidly obese: 'here we don't stuff our mouths with food like you' while having no sense that they are just in a slightly better state than the ones they are chastising.
  - ivan_gammel 4y ago
    I do not understand your argument. We do not use personal cars as often as USA or some other countries, instead relying more on public transportation and bikes - as a result, electricity costs for transportation are quite low for individual households. What's your point? That less than 25% of population do not eat healthy and this is somehow relevant to the conversation?
    - odshoifsdhfs 4y ago
      Among the EU, germans drive more km per car than anyone else except Austria (data from 2000, can't find newer). Among the EU, Germans rank 6th on car ownership per capita (2020 data). Going these together, and it shows within the EU, Germans are the on the top of km per capita and not 'we drive less than others' (except maybe the US) Your reply to someone asking about charging their EV(thus need to drive) was that in Germany that isn't a problem because there you eat healthy and cycle, which is a lie (you drive more than most/all of the EU). (as per cycling data, DE is 7th on daily usage of bikes in the EU, but couldn't find any data regarding number of kilometres though)
      - ivan_gammel 4y ago
        Data from 2000 is missing two decades of economic growth in Eastern Europe and major EU-funded investments in infrastructure in that region. But let's assume, Germany is still high in the ranks. What does it prove? In Europe the life style from Dublin to Warsaw isn't that different: we often live in an apartment rather than in a house in suburb, we rely on public transportation and have great networks, using a bike is a norm in many cities etc. This all means that electricity budget of an individual household is unlikely to include EV charging at the moment. This will be different from USA, where having individual house and traveling by cars is often the only option. So, what's your point exactly?
        xxs 4y ago
        It's still very likely Germans drive more - Germany is very decentralized (which is amazing, e.g. no grid locks), and it has one of the best railroads in the world... still has likely one the best highways as well. The only East European country that can possible change the stats would be Poland (but personally I don't believe that) - the rest are just too small.