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This seems to be a webpage entirely made of buzzwords. Store things cheaply, without blockchains or servers, so where is it stored? No infrastructure, so who i

This seems to be a webpage entirely made of buzzwords. Store things cheaply, without blockchains or servers, so where is it stored? No infrastructure, so who is paying for it? Oh right if you click a little deeper, there's a cryptocurrency token issued on Ethereum you need to buy in order to buy credits to buy compute time in a marketplace of other people's machines. Absolutely nothing interesting going on.

rapnie 4y ago
When posting I was hoping more people would chime in that worked with Holochain, hear about their experiences and impression. I know about Holochain mostly from people name-dropping it. There's a developer section, and it also has documentation on its concepts: https://developer.holochain.org/concepts/ https://developer.holochain.org/concepts/
- verdverm 4y ago
  I doubt there are many developers here who do anything with Blockchain development. Blockchain is pretty well shunned here, generally speaking, exceptions apply.
  - rapnie 4y ago
    Well, that's the thing. I agree with you. And for very long thought Holochain was in that category, until people told me it was not and has a different approach. That is explained here: https://developer.holochain.org/concepts/1_the_basics/#current-solutions https://developer.holochain.org/concepts/1_the_basics/#curre...
    - verdverm 4y ago
      Their speak around doesn't make them different, they are still crypto based, have a token, and spray buzzwords everywhere.
      - rapnie 4y ago
        Yes. If you want to scam, then smart thing to do is avoid the term "blockchain" or explicitly mention you are not blockchain. OTOH, if a complex project is honest, non-blockchain and has a lot of high-level concepts to explain, then the only way to verify its honesty is to deep-dive into the complex codebase. Similar to people telling me "No, Holochain is different", other people say this of Safe Network [0]. Just like until now with Holochain I stay away from that, as I just can't tell without thorough investigation. [0] https://safenetwork.tech/ https://safenetwork.tech/
    - RL_Quine 4y ago
      > These simple building blocks create something surprisingly robust—a multicellular social organism with a memory and an immune system. It mimics the way that biological systems have managed to thrive in the face of novel threats for millions of years. Uh huh.
      - rapnie 4y ago
        Ha ha. Yeah agreed, that is.. hilarious :D
    - bawolff 4y ago
      This is so batshit you'd think it was someone making fun of the blockchain people.
  - pcthrowaway 4y ago
    There are dozens of us! I don't know much about holochain, but it's in the camp of crypto/blockchain projects that sound almost unreasonably ambitious (Multivac, ICP, Saito, and Mina are in this camp as well), but I'm staying away from because.. there's a significant chance they're scams, or that the people working on them are in over their heads. One of these might be the real deal (well.. not Multivac or ICP IMO), and actually deliver something amazing, but I'm staying far away from them until I have a strong reason to believe that's the case.. I don't have time to do a deep dive of every project that promises the moon.
  - hammyhavoc 4y ago
    I've seen them, they've seen me. We've argued. We've brawled.
- RL_Quine 4y ago
  I would bet very strongly that nobody has, or ever will use this for a serious project or service. You walk into a room with something like the diagram below and you're just going to have people laughing in your face. https://holo.host/wp-content/themes/holo/images/Diagram.png https://holo.host/wp-content/themes/holo/images/Diagram.png
  - bawolff 4y ago
    To be fair, high level architecture diagrams of even legitimate services are usually pretty BS too. But i agree in principle.
  - yaddaor 4y ago
    That diagram is perfectly aimed at managers and executives who are the ones throwing away the money. Buzzword galore.
- bawolff 4y ago
  The blockchain ecosystem is famous for people namedropping BS to try and drive buzz (often but not always as part of a pump and dump scheme). I dont know why you think people namedropping something in this space is positive.
  - rapnie 4y ago
    Well, because these people weren't involved in Holochain itself in any way and just looking for decentralized enabling technologies of which HC is but one. They were also people that are just as negative in their view on the blockchain craze as I am myself.
    - padraic7a 4y ago
      Really, they were looking for "looking for decentralized enabling technologies"? Why? I'm suspicious. What problem were they trying to solve?
  - risyachka 4y ago
    So basically like any startup in non-blockchain ecosystem?
    - bawolff 4y ago
      Yes actually. if a start upbis being name dropped everywhere but has no product just buzz words, you should run away too. In a lot of ways, blockchain is taking everything wrong with startups, and magnifying it 100x

rapnie 4y ago

When posting I was hoping more people would chime in that worked with Holochain, hear about their experiences and impression. I know about Holochain mostly from people name-dropping it. There's a developer section, and it also has documentation on its concepts: https://developer.holochain.org/concepts/ https://developer.holochain.org/concepts/

verdverm 4y ago
I doubt there are many developers here who do anything with Blockchain development. Blockchain is pretty well shunned here, generally speaking, exceptions apply.
- rapnie 4y ago
  Well, that's the thing. I agree with you. And for very long thought Holochain was in that category, until people told me it was not and has a different approach. That is explained here: https://developer.holochain.org/concepts/1_the_basics/#current-solutions https://developer.holochain.org/concepts/1_the_basics/#curre...
  - verdverm 4y ago
    Their speak around doesn't make them different, they are still crypto based, have a token, and spray buzzwords everywhere.
    - rapnie 4y ago
      Yes. If you want to scam, then smart thing to do is avoid the term "blockchain" or explicitly mention you are not blockchain. OTOH, if a complex project is honest, non-blockchain and has a lot of high-level concepts to explain, then the only way to verify its honesty is to deep-dive into the complex codebase. Similar to people telling me "No, Holochain is different", other people say this of Safe Network [0]. Just like until now with Holochain I stay away from that, as I just can't tell without thorough investigation. [0] https://safenetwork.tech/ https://safenetwork.tech/
  - RL_Quine 4y ago
    > These simple building blocks create something surprisingly robust—a multicellular social organism with a memory and an immune system. It mimics the way that biological systems have managed to thrive in the face of novel threats for millions of years. Uh huh.
    - rapnie 4y ago
      Ha ha. Yeah agreed, that is.. hilarious :D
  - bawolff 4y ago
    This is so batshit you'd think it was someone making fun of the blockchain people.
- pcthrowaway 4y ago
  There are dozens of us! I don't know much about holochain, but it's in the camp of crypto/blockchain projects that sound almost unreasonably ambitious (Multivac, ICP, Saito, and Mina are in this camp as well), but I'm staying away from because.. there's a significant chance they're scams, or that the people working on them are in over their heads. One of these might be the real deal (well.. not Multivac or ICP IMO), and actually deliver something amazing, but I'm staying far away from them until I have a strong reason to believe that's the case.. I don't have time to do a deep dive of every project that promises the moon.
- hammyhavoc 4y ago
  I've seen them, they've seen me. We've argued. We've brawled.
RL_Quine 4y ago
I would bet very strongly that nobody has, or ever will use this for a serious project or service. You walk into a room with something like the diagram below and you're just going to have people laughing in your face. https://holo.host/wp-content/themes/holo/images/Diagram.png https://holo.host/wp-content/themes/holo/images/Diagram.png
- bawolff 4y ago
  To be fair, high level architecture diagrams of even legitimate services are usually pretty BS too. But i agree in principle.
- yaddaor 4y ago
  That diagram is perfectly aimed at managers and executives who are the ones throwing away the money. Buzzword galore.
bawolff 4y ago
The blockchain ecosystem is famous for people namedropping BS to try and drive buzz (often but not always as part of a pump and dump scheme). I dont know why you think people namedropping something in this space is positive.
- rapnie 4y ago
  Well, because these people weren't involved in Holochain itself in any way and just looking for decentralized enabling technologies of which HC is but one. They were also people that are just as negative in their view on the blockchain craze as I am myself.
  - padraic7a 4y ago
    Really, they were looking for "looking for decentralized enabling technologies"? Why? I'm suspicious. What problem were they trying to solve?
- risyachka 4y ago
  So basically like any startup in non-blockchain ecosystem?
  - bawolff 4y ago
    Yes actually. if a start upbis being name dropped everywhere but has no product just buzz words, you should run away too. In a lot of ways, blockchain is taking everything wrong with startups, and magnifying it 100x