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Recumbent bikes, e-bikes, and other alternatives (https://bicycledutch.wordpress.com/2012/12/06/who-else-benefits-from-the-dutch-cycling-infrastructure/ https:/

Recumbent bikes, e-bikes, and other alternatives (https://bicycledutch.wordpress.com/2012/12/06/who-else-benefits-from-the-dutch-cycling-infrastructure/ https://bicycledutch.wordpress.com/2012/12/06/who-else-benef...) make "bike infrastructure" accessible to pretty much anyone. Considering the fact that it's impossible to live in the USA outside of a nursing home if you lose your ability to drive due to old age... I'm not sure accessibility is a great argument for car-centric infrastructure.

jimmaswell 4y ago
What percentage of people who are too old and disabled to drive a car are fit to ride a bike instead?
- ryukafalz 4y ago
  You’re replying to a post where the source’s headline image is several people using mobility scooters on a cycle path.
  - aldonius 4y ago
    This. Good bike infra is also good mobility-scooter infra.
- dont__panic 4y ago
  They should also be able to walk. If they can't walk, I suspect assisted living is the only option. Imagine you were diagnosed with epilepsy today, and it was so severe you lost your license to protect others. You can still walk around, take public transit -- probably even ride a bicycle. Where would you live in the USA today?
  - aerostable_slug 4y ago
    > If they can't walk, I suspect assisted living is the only option. This is just a terrible take. I have wrecked knees and there are times when I can't walk any significant distance, and I'm not even 50 years old. The f-cars people reek of ableism and it gets really tired, and I'm not even speaking from a position as a disabled person (more like occasionally inconvenienced).
    - asdff 4y ago
      It's only ableist if your community is built solely around the car with no alternatives for these people who rely on cars for mobility due to these issues.
  - ryukafalz 4y ago
    > If they can't walk, I suspect assisted living is the only option. No, as mentioned in my sibling comment (and in the post you linked to earlier!) bike infrastructure also helps people who can't walk. Mobility scooters work fine on a bike path and people who can't walk (or have trouble walking) are among those who would use one. You just need your city design to accommodate it. Bike paths help, as do ramps into buildings or ground-level entrances. (I really wish we could popularize a term other than "bike lanes" for these in the US to acknowledge that they're useful for far more than just bikes.)
  - pandaman 4y ago
    You can live in any decently big city without a car. I know people who live in LA as such. It's just inconvenient and more expensive.
- asdff 4y ago
  All of them with an ebike and bike infrastructure. Hell, a golf cart would be an improvement due to the efficiencies of moving a smaller mass to get to your point A and Bs. Many nursing communities in Florida are in fact golf cart centric. I'd rather have the elderly in command of something that only goes 20mph and weighs 40 lbs than something that is capable of factors more that speed at orders of magnitudes more weight.
  - ryukafalz 4y ago
    There's also the Canta, which you can drive in the bike lanes in the Netherlands: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canta_(vehicle) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canta_(vehicle) Seats one person and can be adapted for various disabilities (you can wheel a wheelchair into one for example). EDIT: Wait apparently some can seat two! Though I don’t think the wheelchair-adapted one can for space reasons.
    - asdff 4y ago
      That's amazing, and it just goes to show if you allow these things in the regulatory environment (they are not allowed currently), then they will be built and purchased by people who benefit from them. It's just a better tool for a job in 99% of the cases. Using a car for each and every trip you take in your life is like using an excavator, when all you need is a hand trowel.

jimmaswell 4y ago

What percentage of people who are too old and disabled to drive a car are fit to ride a bike instead?

ryukafalz 4y ago
You’re replying to a post where the source’s headline image is several people using mobility scooters on a cycle path.
- aldonius 4y ago
  This. Good bike infra is also good mobility-scooter infra.
dont__panic 4y ago
They should also be able to walk. If they can't walk, I suspect assisted living is the only option. Imagine you were diagnosed with epilepsy today, and it was so severe you lost your license to protect others. You can still walk around, take public transit -- probably even ride a bicycle. Where would you live in the USA today?
- aerostable_slug 4y ago
  > If they can't walk, I suspect assisted living is the only option. This is just a terrible take. I have wrecked knees and there are times when I can't walk any significant distance, and I'm not even 50 years old. The f-cars people reek of ableism and it gets really tired, and I'm not even speaking from a position as a disabled person (more like occasionally inconvenienced).
  - asdff 4y ago
    It's only ableist if your community is built solely around the car with no alternatives for these people who rely on cars for mobility due to these issues.
- ryukafalz 4y ago
  > If they can't walk, I suspect assisted living is the only option. No, as mentioned in my sibling comment (and in the post you linked to earlier!) bike infrastructure also helps people who can't walk. Mobility scooters work fine on a bike path and people who can't walk (or have trouble walking) are among those who would use one. You just need your city design to accommodate it. Bike paths help, as do ramps into buildings or ground-level entrances. (I really wish we could popularize a term other than "bike lanes" for these in the US to acknowledge that they're useful for far more than just bikes.)
- pandaman 4y ago
  You can live in any decently big city without a car. I know people who live in LA as such. It's just inconvenient and more expensive.
asdff 4y ago
All of them with an ebike and bike infrastructure. Hell, a golf cart would be an improvement due to the efficiencies of moving a smaller mass to get to your point A and Bs. Many nursing communities in Florida are in fact golf cart centric. I'd rather have the elderly in command of something that only goes 20mph and weighs 40 lbs than something that is capable of factors more that speed at orders of magnitudes more weight.
- ryukafalz 4y ago
  There's also the Canta, which you can drive in the bike lanes in the Netherlands: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canta_(vehicle) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canta_(vehicle) Seats one person and can be adapted for various disabilities (you can wheel a wheelchair into one for example). EDIT: Wait apparently some can seat two! Though I don’t think the wheelchair-adapted one can for space reasons.
  - asdff 4y ago
    That's amazing, and it just goes to show if you allow these things in the regulatory environment (they are not allowed currently), then they will be built and purchased by people who benefit from them. It's just a better tool for a job in 99% of the cases. Using a car for each and every trip you take in your life is like using an excavator, when all you need is a hand trowel.