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Huge premiums != large market. It just means the market is bigger than their production. Manual transmissions are not "an order of magnitude less complex and c
by KennyBlanken 4y ago
Huge premiums != large market. It just means the market is bigger than their production.
Manual transmissions are not "an order of magnitude less complex and cheaper." They're far more expensive because the volume is much lower and every configuration has to be crash-tested, so the cost of that crash testing is amortized over a much, much smaller number of vehicles.
Manual transmission vehicles get significantly worse mileage and this drags down the fleet emissions which means they need to spend significantly more pushing out low or zero emission vehicles, or can't produce as many SUVs and trucks, where the profit margins are highest.
Porsche and Ferrari don't represent the market as a whole, or any significant portion of it. Both are acquired to a large degree as investments - they often appreciate in value if well-cared for, or at least lose significantly less value compared to the average vehicle.
People are buying manual transmission vehicles because they're rare and likely to appreciate in value more, not because they're better in any sense. They get worse gas mileage, are slower, and less capable. Dual-clutch gearboxes can shift fast enough that the limitation in them is the rotational inertia of the engine, to the point that there's little or no interruption in delivered torque, thus enabling shifts without upsetting the balance of the car. No manual transmission car can be up/down shifted during track in / cornering / trackout without upsetting the car's balance; dual-clutch gearbox cars can be. And lastly, they can have more gears.
Early gearboxes had longevity issues (clutches) but that's largely been sorted out and is no worse than manual transmission cars.
- DaveExeter 4y agoNah. Manual transmissions are better.
- layla5alive 4y agoApparently you've never heard about rev matching? Or heel and toe? Most of what you've said is just wrong.
- bsagdiyev 4y ago> No manual transmission car can be up/down shifted during track in / cornering / trackout without upsetting the car's balance; dual-clutch gearbox cars can be. Speak for yourself, but I don't really have much of an issue shifting while going hot through a corner. > And lastly, they can have more gears. Why is this better? Fuel efficiency, sure, but are we going for a Fast and the Furious race scene shifting thing?
- legitster 4y ago> Manual transmissions are not "an order of magnitude less complex and cheaper." Don't take my word for it. Just look at the size of a manual drivetrain vs an automatic. The increase in steel is directly proportional to the engineering required/number of moving parts. >Manual transmission vehicles get significantly worse mileage While it's true that CVTs have finally surpassed manuals for fuel efficiency, I think you are largely overstating the difference. We are taking about 1 to 2 MPG difference. Dual clutches are certainly faster, but again they are huge and complex things. And not more efficient. Among car enthusiasts, they are becoming about as popular as devices that chew your food for you - technically superior, but who cares? >Early gearboxes had longevity issues (clutches) but that's largely been sorted out and is no worse than manual transmission cars. I don't know how someone can take this seriously. A Nissan CVT is not even serviceable - you literally have to swap the entire unit when it goes bad. Which costs more than a used Nissan! Meanwhile a comparable manual will run as long as it's engine. Again, there's fundamentally half as many moving parts in the drive train. You can't escape the laws of thermodynamics.
- adgjlsfhk1 4y agoWhat you're missing about the cost is that engineering cost is amortized. If you spend $10m on the engineering for the manual, and $100m on the engineering for the automatic, the manual will be way more expensive if you only sell 10 of them.
- julianlam 4y agoI, too, can pull numbers out of thin air. But realistically, what additional work are we looking to have done to accommodate a manual gearbox over automatic? Very little I'd imagine.
- ehaliewicz2 4y ago>People are buying manual transmission vehicles because they're rare and likely to appreciate in value more, not because they're better in any sense. I bought mine because it was more fun and engaging than the alternative.
- mywittyname 4y ago> No manual transmission car can be up/down shifted during track in / cornering / trackout without upsetting the car's balance; That auto-rev matching feature is used in DCT cars for smooth down shifting: almost every manual transmission sports car out there has this exact same technology.