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The taxpayer cost is around $300 billion dollars. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/student-loan-forgiveness-10000-cost/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/student-loan-f

The taxpayer cost is around $300 billion dollars. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/student-loan-forgiveness-10000-cost/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/student-loan-forgiveness-10000-... The next time we question if the science projects are worth the cost… Webb Telescope cost: $10 billion CERN particle accelerator cost: $5 billion

2Gkashmiri 4y ago
remind me how much is american military budget?
- codefreeordie 4y ago
  Only about double the cost of today's giveaway
  - 2Gkashmiri 4y ago
    that is yearly, this one i assume is one time
    - codefreeordie 4y ago
      Why would you expect this to be only one time?
- melling 4y ago
  $800 billion. Sort of emphasizes the point that the science projects are cheap. Science pays future dividend.
IceMetalPunk 4y ago
Science definitely needs a bigger budget. There's some interesting math to do here: if the number $300 billion is an accurate estimate of taxpayer cost, and the quick Google I did on the number of taxpayers in the US is correct at 144.3 million, then that means the average cost to an individual taxpayer is about $2,080/year. Which is 1/7 the cost of my own university/student loan expenses, even after financial aid, grants, scholarships, etc. My local public college is $2,800/year. In other words, if these numbers are all correct, then the cost to each taxpayer is less than the cost of public college, and much less than the cost of private universities. And when you consider that students at more expensive universities are more likely to have larger student loans, it shifts the average costs being paid off higher, meaning taxpayers are paying much less than people going to college would need to pay. Obviously this is a simplification, and there are things to consider such as how this is covering everyone who's ever been to college in the US before and hasn't finished paying their loans (as opposed to just the people with new loans, which a policy like this would eventually settle into being).
IceMetalPunk 4y ago
Too late to edit my previous reply, so I'll just add my correction here: I misunderstood and thought the $300 billion was an annual estimate. Well, not so much "misunderstood" -- that's what the article explicitly says. However, the source they cite for that says, and I quote: "We estimate that a one-time maximum debt forgiveness of $10,000 per borrower will cost around $300 billion for borrowers with incomes less than $125,000. This cost increases to $330 billion if the program is continued over the standard 10-year budget window. Eliminating the borrower income limit threshold produces a 10-year cost of $344 billion. Increasing the maximum amount forgiven to $50,000 per borrower increases the total cost to as much as $980 billion." Meaning it's a figure over 10 years. So let's use the main source's numbers instead: $330,000,000,000 / 10 years / 144,300,000 taxpayers = $228 per taxpayer per year. Even better. And just for fun, let's look at the same calculations using the analysis for "no income cap" and then again for a $50k forgiveness cap: No income cap: $238 -- only $10 more per person per year. $50k max forgiveness: $670 per person per year. Obviously more significant, as it's forgiving 1/3 more money on average, but still. Imagine if this policy were put in place for new loans going forward. Everyone in the country could attend college for $670 + tuition excess over $50k, which means most people could do it for $670/year flat. And of course, these estimates all account for the initial massive cost of existing loans; if it were set in motion to apply to new loans, the cost would decrease over time as those old loans are done and only a smaller number of new loans are created.
- Auracle 4y ago
  And the end result of all of that would be universities instantly raising their tuition $10,000 a year or more.
  - IceMetalPunk 4y ago
    Let's hope not, or hope that at least some regulations can be put in place to fix that if it does happen. Let's be clear what you're suggesting here: universities that are doing well on their current tuition, and would still be making the same money in the case of government subsidies, would spike their tuition costs by $10,000+ / year just for extra profit "because they can", despite not needing to, and screwing over everyone in the process. I'm not saying it won't happen, I'm just saying that paints a dark picture of humanity and its almost certainly doomed future if it does and isn't corralled. (BTW, I wonder how the European countries that offer socialized university have countered that effect?)

2Gkashmiri 4y ago

remind me how much is american military budget?

codefreeordie 4y ago
Only about double the cost of today's giveaway
- 2Gkashmiri 4y ago
  that is yearly, this one i assume is one time
  - codefreeordie 4y ago
    Why would you expect this to be only one time?
melling 4y ago
$800 billion. Sort of emphasizes the point that the science projects are cheap. Science pays future dividend.

IceMetalPunk 4y ago

Science definitely needs a bigger budget. There's some interesting math to do here: if the number $300 billion is an accurate estimate of taxpayer cost, and the quick Google I did on the number of taxpayers in the US is correct at 144.3 million, then that means the average cost to an individual taxpayer is about $2,080/year. Which is 1/7 the cost of my own university/student loan expenses, even after financial aid, grants, scholarships, etc. My local public college is $2,800/year. In other words, if these numbers are all correct, then the cost to each taxpayer is less than the cost of public college, and much less than the cost of private universities. And when you consider that students at more expensive universities are more likely to have larger student loans, it shifts the average costs being paid off higher, meaning taxpayers are paying much less than people going to college would need to pay. Obviously this is a simplification, and there are things to consider such as how this is covering everyone who's ever been to college in the US before and hasn't finished paying their loans (as opposed to just the people with new loans, which a policy like this would eventually settle into being).

IceMetalPunk 4y ago

Too late to edit my previous reply, so I'll just add my correction here: I misunderstood and thought the $300 billion was an annual estimate. Well, not so much "misunderstood" -- that's what the article explicitly says. However, the source they cite for that says, and I quote: "We estimate that a one-time maximum debt forgiveness of $10,000 per borrower will cost around $300 billion for borrowers with incomes less than $125,000. This cost increases to $330 billion if the program is continued over the standard 10-year budget window. Eliminating the borrower income limit threshold produces a 10-year cost of $344 billion. Increasing the maximum amount forgiven to $50,000 per borrower increases the total cost to as much as $980 billion." Meaning it's a figure over 10 years. So let's use the main source's numbers instead: $330,000,000,000 / 10 years / 144,300,000 taxpayers = $228 per taxpayer per year. Even better. And just for fun, let's look at the same calculations using the analysis for "no income cap" and then again for a $50k forgiveness cap: No income cap: $238 -- only $10 more per person per year. $50k max forgiveness: $670 per person per year. Obviously more significant, as it's forgiving 1/3 more money on average, but still. Imagine if this policy were put in place for new loans going forward. Everyone in the country could attend college for $670 + tuition excess over $50k, which means most people could do it for $670/year flat. And of course, these estimates all account for the initial massive cost of existing loans; if it were set in motion to apply to new loans, the cost would decrease over time as those old loans are done and only a smaller number of new loans are created.

Auracle 4y ago
And the end result of all of that would be universities instantly raising their tuition $10,000 a year or more.
- IceMetalPunk 4y ago
  Let's hope not, or hope that at least some regulations can be put in place to fix that if it does happen. Let's be clear what you're suggesting here: universities that are doing well on their current tuition, and would still be making the same money in the case of government subsidies, would spike their tuition costs by $10,000+ / year just for extra profit "because they can", despite not needing to, and screwing over everyone in the process. I'm not saying it won't happen, I'm just saying that paints a dark picture of humanity and its almost certainly doomed future if it does and isn't corralled. (BTW, I wonder how the European countries that offer socialized university have countered that effect?)