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This "care" is unnecessary and harmful for most children. Puberty is the cure for most children with body dysphoria; up to 90% of kids who identify as transgend

This "care" is unnecessary and harmful for most children. Puberty is the cure for most children with body dysphoria; up to 90% of kids who identify as transgender desist from this identity post-puberty. However, effects from "gender-affirming care" like a deepened voice, mastectomy, orchiectomy, hysterectomy, and sterilization are irreversible. The long-term effects of puberty blockers especially are unknown, particularly as they affect adolescent brain development. That's without mentioning the usual risks of blood clots, osteoporosis, mood disorders, and cardiovascular events that can result from hormone treatment even in clinical settings. In the UK, the Tavistock clinic for youth gender medicine was recently forced to shut over concerns for patient safety, and findings that staff were rushing children into procedures they later regretted: https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/sep/04/gender-identity-clinic-whistleblower-wins-damages https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/sep/04/gender-ident... The NHS-commissioned Cass Report details the many risks and gaps of evidence underlying youth transition: https://cass.independent-review.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/Cass-Review-Interim-Report-Final-Web-Accessible.pdf https://cass.independent-review.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/0... Former patients are now coming forward to tell how they were harmed: https://www.persuasion.community/p/keira-bell-my-story https://www.persuasion.community/p/keira-bell-my-story In the US, the Society for Evidence-Based Gender Medicine is attempting to spread this knowledge among practitioners: https://segm.org/ https://segm.org/ This issue is highly ideological and politicized on both sides. Suggesting medical transition for any minor is not currently supported by the evidence. National health systems like Sweden's have banned it outside clinical trials. Instructing minors to attempt it themselves without medical or psychological evaluation or monitoring is reckless in the extreme. Doing it for sexual gratification, as some are in Keffals' case, is monstrous.

nathanaldensr 4y ago
- deepdriver 4y ago
  - dzhiurgis 4y ago
  - DanBC 4y ago
    > even repeating verbatim lines from The Guardian articles about the scandal at Tavistock is considered transphobic. The Guardian is so transphobic that their own journalists penned an open letter to complain about it. Almost anything you hear from the Guardian on trans gender issues is going to be heavily biased against trans people. It's a certainty that you've not understood the Tavistock stuff. > In contrast, children in their teens are now undergoing sterilizing surgeries under the label of gender-affirming care. Not in the UK they're not, and I'd be surprised if it was happening in the US.
cholantesh 4y ago
>This issue is highly ideological and politicized on both sides. Suggesting medical transition for any minor is not currently supported by the evidence. Neither is conversion therapy, but SEGM happily associates itself with advocates for it , along with evangelical organizations. Indeed, such advocates are found among 'expert witnesses' in the Tavistock case. Maybe Vice should report on these associations. Maybe people who are just deeply concerned about child welfare should pay attention to them, too.
- deepdriver 4y ago
  As usual, trans activists have co-opted language of the gay rights movement (conversion therapy) to describe an altogether different situation: https://segm.org/danger_of_conflation https://segm.org/danger_of_conflation If you care about kids, don’t ignore the growing body of evidence that suggests youth transition is overwhelmingly harmful. Don’t ignore stories like Chloe’s: https://twitter.com/ChoooCole/status/1560495012999151616 https://twitter.com/ChoooCole/status/1560495012999151616 The harm will be obvious to all once the lawsuits get rolling: https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/britains-gender-youth-clinic-faces-mass-legal-action/ https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/britains-gender-youth-...
  - cholantesh 4y ago
    I don't think there is any 'danger of conflation', particularly, again, given that SEGM is also closely linked to evangelical organizations, who were trying this sort of thing 20 years ago with intelligent design. >If you care about kids, don’t ignore the growing body of evidence that suggests youth transition is overwhelmingly harmful. Don’t ignore stories like Chloe’s I think that the fact that transphobes can weaponize a few more anecdotes about detransitioning this year than last year is not particularly meaningful. In the aggregate, these stories account for a tiny minority: https://epath.eu/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Boof-of-abstracts-EPATH2019.pdf https://epath.eu/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Boof-of-abstract... https://transequality.org/sites/default/files/docs/usts/USTS-Full-Report-Dec17.pdf https://transequality.org/sites/default/files/docs/usts/USTS... https://www.researchgate.net/publication/262734734_An_Analysis_of_All_Applications_for_Sex_Reassignment_Surgery_in_Sweden_1960-2010_Prevalence_Incidence_and_Regrets https://www.researchgate.net/publication/262734734_An_Analys... https://www.jsm.jsexmed.org/article/S1743-6095(18)30057-2/fulltext#sec3.3 https://www.jsm.jsexmed.org/article/S1743-6095(18)30057-2/fu... The largest cohort comprises 8% of the sample, 62% of whom did so because they were pressured by their family, not because they had regrets about choosing to transition. >The harm will be obvious to all once the lawsuits get rolling Has the harm of MMR vaccination become obvious because lawsuits have managed to 'get rolling' and even succeeded in that context?
DanBC 4y ago
Bell wasn't a child when she had hormones or surgery. Bell was told by her psychiatrist at Tavi not to go ahead with transition. She ignored that advice and went ahead anyway. You'll notice that she hasn't brought a personal injury case. She'd lose it if she did. She had capacity to make a decision. She made an unwise decision, and now she's living with the consequences of her own poor choices. Is your position seriously that capacitous adults should be banned from making decisions about their healthcare? > The NHS-commissioned Cass Report details the many risks and gaps of evidence underlying youth transition: The Cass review has led to the closure of the single clinic providing child trans healthcare in England, but has led to the opening of many more child trans healthcare clinics across England. The Cass review is clear that the problems were mostly lack of access to timely care. I don't understand why you think this is a victory for the anti-trans position, it simply isn't. Many more children are now going to be able to access timely care, and many more children will be able to access puberty blockers.

nathanaldensr 4y ago

deepdriver 4y ago
- dzhiurgis 4y ago
- DanBC 4y ago
  > even repeating verbatim lines from The Guardian articles about the scandal at Tavistock is considered transphobic. The Guardian is so transphobic that their own journalists penned an open letter to complain about it. Almost anything you hear from the Guardian on trans gender issues is going to be heavily biased against trans people. It's a certainty that you've not understood the Tavistock stuff. > In contrast, children in their teens are now undergoing sterilizing surgeries under the label of gender-affirming care. Not in the UK they're not, and I'd be surprised if it was happening in the US.

cholantesh 4y ago

>This issue is highly ideological and politicized on both sides. Suggesting medical transition for any minor is not currently supported by the evidence. Neither is conversion therapy, but SEGM happily associates itself with advocates for it , along with evangelical organizations. Indeed, such advocates are found among 'expert witnesses' in the Tavistock case. Maybe Vice should report on these associations. Maybe people who are just deeply concerned about child welfare should pay attention to them, too.

deepdriver 4y ago
As usual, trans activists have co-opted language of the gay rights movement (conversion therapy) to describe an altogether different situation: https://segm.org/danger_of_conflation https://segm.org/danger_of_conflation If you care about kids, don’t ignore the growing body of evidence that suggests youth transition is overwhelmingly harmful. Don’t ignore stories like Chloe’s: https://twitter.com/ChoooCole/status/1560495012999151616 https://twitter.com/ChoooCole/status/1560495012999151616 The harm will be obvious to all once the lawsuits get rolling: https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/britains-gender-youth-clinic-faces-mass-legal-action/ https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/britains-gender-youth-...
- cholantesh 4y ago
  I don't think there is any 'danger of conflation', particularly, again, given that SEGM is also closely linked to evangelical organizations, who were trying this sort of thing 20 years ago with intelligent design. >If you care about kids, don’t ignore the growing body of evidence that suggests youth transition is overwhelmingly harmful. Don’t ignore stories like Chloe’s I think that the fact that transphobes can weaponize a few more anecdotes about detransitioning this year than last year is not particularly meaningful. In the aggregate, these stories account for a tiny minority: https://epath.eu/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Boof-of-abstracts-EPATH2019.pdf https://epath.eu/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Boof-of-abstract... https://transequality.org/sites/default/files/docs/usts/USTS-Full-Report-Dec17.pdf https://transequality.org/sites/default/files/docs/usts/USTS... https://www.researchgate.net/publication/262734734_An_Analysis_of_All_Applications_for_Sex_Reassignment_Surgery_in_Sweden_1960-2010_Prevalence_Incidence_and_Regrets https://www.researchgate.net/publication/262734734_An_Analys... https://www.jsm.jsexmed.org/article/S1743-6095(18)30057-2/fulltext#sec3.3 https://www.jsm.jsexmed.org/article/S1743-6095(18)30057-2/fu... The largest cohort comprises 8% of the sample, 62% of whom did so because they were pressured by their family, not because they had regrets about choosing to transition. >The harm will be obvious to all once the lawsuits get rolling Has the harm of MMR vaccination become obvious because lawsuits have managed to 'get rolling' and even succeeded in that context?

DanBC 4y ago

Bell wasn't a child when she had hormones or surgery. Bell was told by her psychiatrist at Tavi not to go ahead with transition. She ignored that advice and went ahead anyway. You'll notice that she hasn't brought a personal injury case. She'd lose it if she did. She had capacity to make a decision. She made an unwise decision, and now she's living with the consequences of her own poor choices. Is your position seriously that capacitous adults should be banned from making decisions about their healthcare? > The NHS-commissioned Cass Report details the many risks and gaps of evidence underlying youth transition: The Cass review has led to the closure of the single clinic providing child trans healthcare in England, but has led to the opening of many more child trans healthcare clinics across England. The Cass review is clear that the problems were mostly lack of access to timely care. I don't understand why you think this is a victory for the anti-trans position, it simply isn't. Many more children are now going to be able to access timely care, and many more children will be able to access puberty blockers.