4 ms·

I would say that yes, it is. Sure, you can fire up MSFS 2020 and look around with the mouse and go, 'yep, looks like a plane'. But switch to VR and it's "omg, t

I would say that yes, it is. Sure, you can fire up MSFS 2020 and look around with the mouse and go, 'yep, looks like a plane'. But switch to VR and it's "omg, that's a plane! Also, I had no idea the cockpit was so tiny!" You actually get an idea of the scale of the plane you are flying in. You get better distance perception too, as you would expect. Once the initial shock passes, you are done looking around and you decide to actually fly, you'll notice a major difference: you will spend more time looking out of the cockpit. Just like you would expect in a real aircraft flying under VFR. Because it's easy, and natural to do. Generally people spend too much time looking at instruments when flight simming. Because as gorgeous as the MSFS scenery is, it's still 2D. That changes a lot when you can look out. And no, TrackIR is not a good substitute. It does help, but it all feels 'fake'. The thing is, specially with the current VR generation, that looking at cockpit instruments is actually a hassle (even more so for glass cockpits). The resolution is good enough for scenery but not as good if you want to read fine print. Of course you can move your head and 'look closer' at them just like if you had bad eyesight. It's totally doable, but can be tiring. Bottom line. I would say it's very worth it specially if you fly GA aircraft (big tubes doing standard procedures at 30000ft are ok too, but stereoscopic volumetric clouds can only hold one's interest for so long). If we had higher resolution, I would say "absolutely, get one yesterday". As it is, there's a good chance you'll like it, and you can do it with even a first generation Rift, or a Quest. As for GPUs. I could run on a RX580 by turning down a bunch of settings. You need to keep the framerate up. I would not recommend going that low end - even more now that GPU prices are coming down – as I would still get nasty frame skips from time to time. But hey, it worked. I got a AMD 5700XT and it runs perfectly fine now. The official recommended VR specs are a RTX 2080Ti or better. Minimum is listed as GTX1080.

ryandrake 4y ago
> Just like you would expect in a real aircraft flying under VFR. Because it's easy, and natural to do. Generally people spend too much time looking at instruments when flight simming. They also can spend too much time looking at instruments when flying VFR. It's something a real CFI will(should) remind you when you're doing your flight training: Do your scan but remember to otherwise keep your eyes outside the window. Especially today, with all the glass panels, moving maps, ADS-B traffic displays... the temptation to fly with your nose in the cockpit is ever present.
- traceroute66 4y ago
  > It's something a real CFI will(should) remind you when you're doing your flight training: I used to be an avid simmer. Until I learnt to fly. I remember it to this day, it was about lesson 5 or 6. The instructor turned to me and said .... "do you flight sim ?" To which I replied in the affirmative. And he simply said "Well, stop it". I took him at his word, never used a sim after that moment, all the little niggles and issues I was having disappeared. I will always appreciate the directness and honesty of that instructor. People are kidding themselves if they think a sim is the "same thing". Its not, it will never be. No matter how may R&D hours the sim writers put into fancy graphics and even fancier algorithms, you will never be able to replicate the real thing. A real aircraft in the real sky (even a simple single-engine prop), will behave entirely differently than a relatively naïve software model that's designed to work on your average desktop computer.
  - capableweb 4y ago
    I wouldn't dismiss them so outright. Probably true if you're planning to be a full-time commercial pilot, but people wanting to fly recreationally, it can give them a headstart. I only have my own anecdote when I was out flying for the first time in a small Cessna. I have no formal pilot training, and when we were in the air, pilot friend asked me if I wanted to fly for a minute or two. After controlling it for a bit and being able to perfectly follow her commands, she was surprised when I told her that I have no proper training, I had only been "flying" with X-Plane for some years before. After that, I did something that probably I wouldn't do again unless there was an emergency (and my friend would probably lose her license if it was known), but she offered me to land the plane and so I did, without any hiccups. Keep in mind, this was on a small airfield out in the middle of nowhere, with no houses or even proper roads around.
    - traceroute66 4y ago
      > but people wanting to fly recreationally, it can give them a headstart. No it won't. It will make them over-confident in their abilities by detaching them from reality and allowing them to build upon all sorts of bad habits. Trust me, as I said, I was that person. I had bad habits. The instructor instinctinvley knew where they came from. For a start, flying an aircraft is composed of three elements, "Aviate, Navigate, Communicate". The skill of a good pilot is to be able to juggle all three. No matter what is going on with the aircraft. No matter how busy the airspace is that you are flying with. You can't do that in a sim, even the multi-million big-jet sims the airlines use. The airlines use them purely for specific, targetted, procedural training (which is always fully supervised by a third person who is not "flying"). You can't simulate the randomness of real-life in all three aspects of aviation. Also, on your home sim you just can't replicate reality. For example, a common item during training is to simulate loss of situational awareness (i.e. you suddenly don't know where you are). The answer to that is to put your aircraft in an orbit (maintaining constant altitude, constant speed) and get a radio fix from beacons on the ground. Meanwhile not forgetting about the effect of winds, and not forgetting the busy airspace around you. And that you have to balance a printed map on your lap. No cheating with GPS. Doing that in real life in a small aircraft where you don't have the luxury of an autopilot, only a trim wheel is an ask for a trainee .... you're kidding yourself it you think you can realistically replicate that in any sim, let alone a home one. Its far too easy with a joystick and a cup of tea sitting in your comfortable chair infront of your computer !
outside1234 4y ago
Thanks - this is super insightful For the controls do you just use the HOTAS / other hardware controls or is there an VR experience too where you can reach out and change the radio for instance?
- izacus 4y ago
  You can use the "hand" controllers to click on things. It's a bit of a hassle though, since you don't SEE them on the table when you need to pick them up :)

ryandrake 4y ago

> Just like you would expect in a real aircraft flying under VFR. Because it's easy, and natural to do. Generally people spend too much time looking at instruments when flight simming. They also can spend too much time looking at instruments when flying VFR. It's something a real CFI will(should) remind you when you're doing your flight training: Do your scan but remember to otherwise keep your eyes outside the window. Especially today, with all the glass panels, moving maps, ADS-B traffic displays... the temptation to fly with your nose in the cockpit is ever present.

traceroute66 4y ago
> It's something a real CFI will(should) remind you when you're doing your flight training: I used to be an avid simmer. Until I learnt to fly. I remember it to this day, it was about lesson 5 or 6. The instructor turned to me and said .... "do you flight sim ?" To which I replied in the affirmative. And he simply said "Well, stop it". I took him at his word, never used a sim after that moment, all the little niggles and issues I was having disappeared. I will always appreciate the directness and honesty of that instructor. People are kidding themselves if they think a sim is the "same thing". Its not, it will never be. No matter how may R&D hours the sim writers put into fancy graphics and even fancier algorithms, you will never be able to replicate the real thing. A real aircraft in the real sky (even a simple single-engine prop), will behave entirely differently than a relatively naïve software model that's designed to work on your average desktop computer.
- capableweb 4y ago
  I wouldn't dismiss them so outright. Probably true if you're planning to be a full-time commercial pilot, but people wanting to fly recreationally, it can give them a headstart. I only have my own anecdote when I was out flying for the first time in a small Cessna. I have no formal pilot training, and when we were in the air, pilot friend asked me if I wanted to fly for a minute or two. After controlling it for a bit and being able to perfectly follow her commands, she was surprised when I told her that I have no proper training, I had only been "flying" with X-Plane for some years before. After that, I did something that probably I wouldn't do again unless there was an emergency (and my friend would probably lose her license if it was known), but she offered me to land the plane and so I did, without any hiccups. Keep in mind, this was on a small airfield out in the middle of nowhere, with no houses or even proper roads around.
  - traceroute66 4y ago
    > but people wanting to fly recreationally, it can give them a headstart. No it won't. It will make them over-confident in their abilities by detaching them from reality and allowing them to build upon all sorts of bad habits. Trust me, as I said, I was that person. I had bad habits. The instructor instinctinvley knew where they came from. For a start, flying an aircraft is composed of three elements, "Aviate, Navigate, Communicate". The skill of a good pilot is to be able to juggle all three. No matter what is going on with the aircraft. No matter how busy the airspace is that you are flying with. You can't do that in a sim, even the multi-million big-jet sims the airlines use. The airlines use them purely for specific, targetted, procedural training (which is always fully supervised by a third person who is not "flying"). You can't simulate the randomness of real-life in all three aspects of aviation. Also, on your home sim you just can't replicate reality. For example, a common item during training is to simulate loss of situational awareness (i.e. you suddenly don't know where you are). The answer to that is to put your aircraft in an orbit (maintaining constant altitude, constant speed) and get a radio fix from beacons on the ground. Meanwhile not forgetting about the effect of winds, and not forgetting the busy airspace around you. And that you have to balance a printed map on your lap. No cheating with GPS. Doing that in real life in a small aircraft where you don't have the luxury of an autopilot, only a trim wheel is an ask for a trainee .... you're kidding yourself it you think you can realistically replicate that in any sim, let alone a home one. Its far too easy with a joystick and a cup of tea sitting in your comfortable chair infront of your computer !

outside1234 4y ago

Thanks - this is super insightful For the controls do you just use the HOTAS / other hardware controls or is there an VR experience too where you can reach out and change the radio for instance?

izacus 4y ago
You can use the "hand" controllers to click on things. It's a bit of a hassle though, since you don't SEE them on the table when you need to pick them up :)