4 ms·

Actually they remain mired in poverty largely because the US keeps meddling in their affairs: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_involvement_in_regime_

Actually they remain mired in poverty largely because the US keeps meddling in their affairs: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_involvement_in_regime_change https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_involvement_in_r... So it's more like "they remain mired in poverty because of the United States' predilection for predatory capitalism."

relativ575 4y ago
Notice how on that list none of South America countries appear after 1990s? Venezuela has been hostile to the US, yet they are still there. Brazil, Argentina, Chile, Ecuador, Peru, Bolivia have elected socialism-leaning governments multiple times during the last 30 years. Not to mention Nicaragua or Mexico, that are not considered South America. Colombia is the latest example. So they are poor because of US meddling, and not even a tiny part due to their policies? You have to try harder if you want to blame their issues on the US.
- trs8080 4y ago
  > Notice how on that list none of South America countries appear after 1990s? This is regime change /that we know about/. Intelligence agencies haven't made a huge habit of discussing their covert successes. > Venezuela has been hostile to the US, yet they are still there. Yes, because the international response would be quite severe if the US decided to what - destroy Venezuela? Foreign occupations and coups decimate countries who then have to deal with the effects for generations. The new regime is usually beholden to the powers that put it there (or the old one has to abide by the occupier's demands), permanently crippling the government or the economy or both. Many countries continue to suffer under the conditions created by their overthrowers, so maybe they share some blame but it's largely the longlasting effects of foreign incursions. > You have to try harder if you want to blame their issues on the US. It's really not that difficult to understand cause and effect here. If you destroy a country's economy, divide its people, cripple it's infrastructure, and install an authoritarian government, it's going to take a long time to recover.
  - WalterBright 4y ago
    > that we know about I.e. there's no evidence.
    - ChuckNorris89 4y ago
      >I.e. there's no evidence. It's not like the CIA likes to document its dark-ops in Latin Am. on wikipedia as proof for you.
      - _kbh_ 4y ago
        > It's not like the CIA likes to document its dark-ops in Latin Am. on wikipedia as proof for you. This is still not proof of anything happening, just because someone wants something to be true doesn't make it so.
WalterBright 4y ago
How about this: "Argentina’s Long Road to Ruin A century’s worth of corruption and leftist politics devastated this once-rich nation." https://www.wsj.com/articles/argentinas-long-road-to-ruin-hyperinflation-exchange-rate-black-market-fernandez-social-weflare-poverty-pandemic-corruption-maduro-11661095679 https://www.wsj.com/articles/argentinas-long-road-to-ruin-hy...
- trs8080 4y ago
  Yes, the US had its hand in Argentina as well - they supported the violent military junta that saw Peron overthrown and leftist journalists and activists murdered by the thousands during the Dirty War. When I was studying there, the family I stayed with had relatives who had been abducted and "disappeared," which was such a widespread phenomenon under the right wing government that they have a name: "Los Desaparecidos". Here's a Wikipedia article about how the CIA contributed: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Condor#Argentina https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Condor#Argentina Also, your article is unfortunately paywalled, but an op-ed from someone at the WSJ isn't going to change my mind.
  - WalterBright 4y ago
    > Operation Condor ended 40 years ago. The article I cited is today. > but an op-ed from someone at the WSJ isn't going to change my mind Not very open-minded to close your mind to something you haven't read. Do you know what is happening to Argentina today?
    - TomSwirly 4y ago
      https://www.poynter.org/commentary/2021/why-would-the-wall-street-journal-run-these-false-claims-from-trump/ https://www.poynter.org/commentary/2021/why-would-the-wall-s... I'm no liberal. And I used to read the Wall Street Journal every day before Murdoch. Now it's a pack of lies all the time.

relativ575 4y ago

Notice how on that list none of South America countries appear after 1990s? Venezuela has been hostile to the US, yet they are still there. Brazil, Argentina, Chile, Ecuador, Peru, Bolivia have elected socialism-leaning governments multiple times during the last 30 years. Not to mention Nicaragua or Mexico, that are not considered South America. Colombia is the latest example. So they are poor because of US meddling, and not even a tiny part due to their policies? You have to try harder if you want to blame their issues on the US.

trs8080 4y ago
> Notice how on that list none of South America countries appear after 1990s? This is regime change /that we know about/. Intelligence agencies haven't made a huge habit of discussing their covert successes. > Venezuela has been hostile to the US, yet they are still there. Yes, because the international response would be quite severe if the US decided to what - destroy Venezuela? Foreign occupations and coups decimate countries who then have to deal with the effects for generations. The new regime is usually beholden to the powers that put it there (or the old one has to abide by the occupier's demands), permanently crippling the government or the economy or both. Many countries continue to suffer under the conditions created by their overthrowers, so maybe they share some blame but it's largely the longlasting effects of foreign incursions. > You have to try harder if you want to blame their issues on the US. It's really not that difficult to understand cause and effect here. If you destroy a country's economy, divide its people, cripple it's infrastructure, and install an authoritarian government, it's going to take a long time to recover.
- WalterBright 4y ago
  > that we know about I.e. there's no evidence.
  - ChuckNorris89 4y ago
    >I.e. there's no evidence. It's not like the CIA likes to document its dark-ops in Latin Am. on wikipedia as proof for you.
    - _kbh_ 4y ago
      > It's not like the CIA likes to document its dark-ops in Latin Am. on wikipedia as proof for you. This is still not proof of anything happening, just because someone wants something to be true doesn't make it so.

WalterBright 4y ago

How about this: "Argentina’s Long Road to Ruin A century’s worth of corruption and leftist politics devastated this once-rich nation." https://www.wsj.com/articles/argentinas-long-road-to-ruin-hyperinflation-exchange-rate-black-market-fernandez-social-weflare-poverty-pandemic-corruption-maduro-11661095679 https://www.wsj.com/articles/argentinas-long-road-to-ruin-hy...

trs8080 4y ago
Yes, the US had its hand in Argentina as well - they supported the violent military junta that saw Peron overthrown and leftist journalists and activists murdered by the thousands during the Dirty War. When I was studying there, the family I stayed with had relatives who had been abducted and "disappeared," which was such a widespread phenomenon under the right wing government that they have a name: "Los Desaparecidos". Here's a Wikipedia article about how the CIA contributed: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Condor#Argentina https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Condor#Argentina Also, your article is unfortunately paywalled, but an op-ed from someone at the WSJ isn't going to change my mind.
- WalterBright 4y ago
  > Operation Condor ended 40 years ago. The article I cited is today. > but an op-ed from someone at the WSJ isn't going to change my mind Not very open-minded to close your mind to something you haven't read. Do you know what is happening to Argentina today?
  - TomSwirly 4y ago
    https://www.poynter.org/commentary/2021/why-would-the-wall-street-journal-run-these-false-claims-from-trump/ https://www.poynter.org/commentary/2021/why-would-the-wall-s... I'm no liberal. And I used to read the Wall Street Journal every day before Murdoch. Now it's a pack of lies all the time.