3 ms·

There are numerous ways to obtain crypto where it would be impossible to identify the owner of a wallet. e.g. mining crypto isn't KYC, or buying KYC crypto and

by toolz 4y ago

There are numerous ways to obtain crypto where it would be impossible to identify the owner of a wallet. e.g. mining crypto isn't KYC, or buying KYC crypto and trading it for a private ledger like monero on a non-KYC platform (and many exist, legally) just to name a couple of ways you can obtain crypto with absolute guarantees your wallet can't be attached to your identity. (provided you don't leak metadata thru other means such as simply telling someone your wallet address)

kube-system 4y ago
I agree... if you don't do anything in the real world with crypto, it is difficult to link it to the real world. But that's missing the point. But criminals do more things than just holding crypto in a wallet. And it's those other things that burn them: Interactions with other people, being subject to search and seizure, transacting for other assets, or committing crimes. At the end of the day, what point is there in being a criminal if you never spend your money?
- toolz 4y ago
  I think there's some disconnect here but I'm not sure where. In my scenario I have crypto sitting in my wallet that can't be linked to any other wallet. That means when I buy coffee with that wallet there is zero way for starbucks to also see that I bought something at target with a different wallet. Again, this is achievable in many different ways. Today, anybody with a trivial amount of knowledge on basic feature sets of various coins can do this. You can't link me to the coins I earn via mining, you can't link me to the coins I spent on some other private chain (e.g. monero) and thus when I buy starbucks with a wallet, quite literally only starbucks will know that I had enough funds in a wallet to pay for a coffee and unless starbucks goes KYC then they also won't have metadata linking my identity to that purchase anymore than if I had used cash.
  - kube-system 4y ago
    There are plenty of exploits that can be used to determine that you transacted with Starbucks, regardless of your payment technology. The idea is simple, you don’t do a direct attack on the technology, you collect information from tangential sources which are not protected by anything on chain. 1. Someone can physically observe you 2. Someone can observe the surveillance camera footage 3. Your device may be compromised 4. The network you are using may be compromised 5. Starbucks may divulge that transaction to others 6. Someone may compel Starbucks to divulge the information 7. Someone may physically steal your private keys while in the Starbucks 8. You might tell the barista your real name Etc. Now Starbucks is perfectly legal and nobody cares that you bought a coffee, so nobody does this. But if it were $50m worth of illegal drugs, someone may assign some resources to doing so. Anyone who engages in crime for profit is inherently interacting with other people, and eventually, hoping to turn those tokens into physical wealth. Crypto isn’t the first pseudoanonymous currency. The way you catch a drug dealer that uses monero is exactly the same way you catch one that uses cash.

by toolz 4y ago

kube-system 4y ago

I agree... if you don't do anything in the real world with crypto, it is difficult to link it to the real world. But that's missing the point. But criminals do more things than just holding crypto in a wallet. And it's those other things that burn them: Interactions with other people, being subject to search and seizure, transacting for other assets, or committing crimes. At the end of the day, what point is there in being a criminal if you never spend your money?

toolz 4y ago
I think there's some disconnect here but I'm not sure where. In my scenario I have crypto sitting in my wallet that can't be linked to any other wallet. That means when I buy coffee with that wallet there is zero way for starbucks to also see that I bought something at target with a different wallet. Again, this is achievable in many different ways. Today, anybody with a trivial amount of knowledge on basic feature sets of various coins can do this. You can't link me to the coins I earn via mining, you can't link me to the coins I spent on some other private chain (e.g. monero) and thus when I buy starbucks with a wallet, quite literally only starbucks will know that I had enough funds in a wallet to pay for a coffee and unless starbucks goes KYC then they also won't have metadata linking my identity to that purchase anymore than if I had used cash.
- kube-system 4y ago
  There are plenty of exploits that can be used to determine that you transacted with Starbucks, regardless of your payment technology. The idea is simple, you don’t do a direct attack on the technology, you collect information from tangential sources which are not protected by anything on chain. 1. Someone can physically observe you 2. Someone can observe the surveillance camera footage 3. Your device may be compromised 4. The network you are using may be compromised 5. Starbucks may divulge that transaction to others 6. Someone may compel Starbucks to divulge the information 7. Someone may physically steal your private keys while in the Starbucks 8. You might tell the barista your real name Etc. Now Starbucks is perfectly legal and nobody cares that you bought a coffee, so nobody does this. But if it were $50m worth of illegal drugs, someone may assign some resources to doing so. Anyone who engages in crime for profit is inherently interacting with other people, and eventually, hoping to turn those tokens into physical wealth. Crypto isn’t the first pseudoanonymous currency. The way you catch a drug dealer that uses monero is exactly the same way you catch one that uses cash.