4 ms·

Exactly, node is useful for solving problems that you don't have. So you wouldn't use node for them, then. The answer to your own question is your own statement

by geuis 15y ago

Exactly, node is useful for solving problems that you don't have. So you wouldn't use node for them, then. The answer to your own question is your own statement. Node makes it possible to do completely new things that would be difficult to do otherwise. I take exception to this statement: "Node enthusiasts are front-end coders not wanting to do server coding." The number of engineers who only do server-side programming these days are few and far between. I haven't worked a job in the last 4 years where no one touched the frontend at some point or vice-versa. Sure, we usually have niches where we do the majority of our work, either front or backend. But at no point are they exclusive. Node has been a blessing for me, as a frontend engineer, because I can finally code servers in the same mindset as I write client-side javascript. We (frontend folks) live in an asynchronous world. We eat parallel requests, xhr, and async callbacks all day. It turns out that when you apply those same concepts to the server, it opens up a whole new world of possibilities.

dextorious 15y ago
"""Exactly, node is useful for solving problems that you don't have. So you wouldn't use node for them, then. The answer to your own question is your own statement.""" You'd be surprised how many people take the wrong answer, then. I've seen tons of posts touting Node from people with needs and problems that would be better served by other technologies. """Node makes it possible to do completely new things that would be difficult to do otherwise.""" Really? Like what? Besides running server side js (something that Netscape did back in the mid-nineties), Node offers nothing that one of the tons of evented servers/libs around could not previously handle. . I personally like the Mongrel2 approach --combined with some non-blocking framework you got all the Node goodness, plus traditional server goodness, plus messaging, plus language agnosticity.
zzzeek 15y ago
"Node has been a blessing for me, as a frontend engineer, because I can finally code servers in the same mindset as I write client-side javascript. " That was precisely the author's point. You'd rather stick with what you know then bother to deal with traditional server side techniques.
- geuis 15y ago
  I already do that. If I need to write a more traditional kind of page, I use Django and Python. Easy to setup, excellent framework and language to work with. I use node for new cutting edge things which Django and Python can handle, but not as easily as node.
  - sofuture 15y ago
    I use node for new cutting edge things which Django and Python can handle, but not as easily as node. Like what?
    - ricardobeat 15y ago
      Like massive concurrency? Websockets?
      - moe 15y ago
        For rather small values of "massive" perhaps (i.e. single-server?). Once you reach into realms where the label "massive" comes into play the importance of per-host performance is usually dwarfed by attributes like robustness and maturity.
        deleted 15y ago
        [deleted]
  - lucian1900 15y ago
    Why not just use Twisted? It's a lot more mature and complete than node, and you don't have to deal with JavaScript either.
- maratd 15y ago
  Uhmm, I've been writing server side code for the last decade. I've also been writing front facing code for just as long. JavaScript works well for Node because it is a language that has evolved to be asynchronous. Not because some front-end web monkey n00bz know JavaScript. Although that is certainly a plus. Node.JS shines when you need to write network applications. It was advertised for this purpose by its creator. That is its stated goal. Traditional server-side solutions SUCK at this. Try writing a non-blocking server-side WebSocket server in PHP and distribute the load across all of the cores. Yeah. Exactly. Don't get me wrong, I love PHP. But for every job, a proper tool. Node.JS takes care of the network server and hands off the work to PHP via FastCGI. That's how it should be. Node.JS solves real problems right now. If it isn't doing that, you're trying to hammer in a nail with a screwdriver. Stop it.
inopinatus 15y ago
Parallel requests and async callbacks have been hallmarks of server programming for decades. You'd have to be pretty young to think this is novel. Good protocol library designers have always exposed some mechanism for kernel-assisted polling (such as the file descriptor for the TCP socket of an LDAP connection). So, Node solves problems we've already solved, only now using the second most poorly designed common production language available today (first place is reserved for PHP).
- ricardobeat 15y ago
  Right, that's why most servers nowadays are written in this mystery platform that you failed to mention.
  - inopinatus 15y ago
    C.
    - ricardobeat 15y ago
      Oh the irony...
- dmpk2k 15y ago
  With that attitude we should have stopped at FORTRAN. What next, drive a Model T instead of a Civic? Nobody knowledgeable has said that async coding is novel. What matters is that node.js is a simple(r) and effective means of writing asynchronous applications.

by geuis 15y ago

dextorious 15y ago

"""Exactly, node is useful for solving problems that you don't have. So you wouldn't use node for them, then. The answer to your own question is your own statement.""" You'd be surprised how many people take the wrong answer, then. I've seen tons of posts touting Node from people with needs and problems that would be better served by other technologies. """Node makes it possible to do completely new things that would be difficult to do otherwise.""" Really? Like what? Besides running server side js (something that Netscape did back in the mid-nineties), Node offers nothing that one of the tons of evented servers/libs around could not previously handle. . I personally like the Mongrel2 approach --combined with some non-blocking framework you got all the Node goodness, plus traditional server goodness, plus messaging, plus language agnosticity.

zzzeek 15y ago

"Node has been a blessing for me, as a frontend engineer, because I can finally code servers in the same mindset as I write client-side javascript. " That was precisely the author's point. You'd rather stick with what you know then bother to deal with traditional server side techniques.

geuis 15y ago
I already do that. If I need to write a more traditional kind of page, I use Django and Python. Easy to setup, excellent framework and language to work with. I use node for new cutting edge things which Django and Python can handle, but not as easily as node.
- sofuture 15y ago
  I use node for new cutting edge things which Django and Python can handle, but not as easily as node. Like what?
  - ricardobeat 15y ago
    Like massive concurrency? Websockets?
    - moe 15y ago
      For rather small values of "massive" perhaps (i.e. single-server?). Once you reach into realms where the label "massive" comes into play the importance of per-host performance is usually dwarfed by attributes like robustness and maturity.
      - deleted 15y ago
        [deleted]
- lucian1900 15y ago
  Why not just use Twisted? It's a lot more mature and complete than node, and you don't have to deal with JavaScript either.
maratd 15y ago
Uhmm, I've been writing server side code for the last decade. I've also been writing front facing code for just as long. JavaScript works well for Node because it is a language that has evolved to be asynchronous. Not because some front-end web monkey n00bz know JavaScript. Although that is certainly a plus. Node.JS shines when you need to write network applications. It was advertised for this purpose by its creator. That is its stated goal. Traditional server-side solutions SUCK at this. Try writing a non-blocking server-side WebSocket server in PHP and distribute the load across all of the cores. Yeah. Exactly. Don't get me wrong, I love PHP. But for every job, a proper tool. Node.JS takes care of the network server and hands off the work to PHP via FastCGI. That's how it should be. Node.JS solves real problems right now. If it isn't doing that, you're trying to hammer in a nail with a screwdriver. Stop it.

inopinatus 15y ago

Parallel requests and async callbacks have been hallmarks of server programming for decades. You'd have to be pretty young to think this is novel. Good protocol library designers have always exposed some mechanism for kernel-assisted polling (such as the file descriptor for the TCP socket of an LDAP connection). So, Node solves problems we've already solved, only now using the second most poorly designed common production language available today (first place is reserved for PHP).

ricardobeat 15y ago
Right, that's why most servers nowadays are written in this mystery platform that you failed to mention.
- inopinatus 15y ago
  C.
  - ricardobeat 15y ago
    Oh the irony...
dmpk2k 15y ago
With that attitude we should have stopped at FORTRAN. What next, drive a Model T instead of a Civic? Nobody knowledgeable has said that async coding is novel. What matters is that node.js is a simple(r) and effective means of writing asynchronous applications.