3 ms·

It's funny -- and I do sympathize, it's always frustrating when you have some preference and the market moves so you can't get what you want, it happens to all

It's funny -- and I do sympathize, it's always frustrating when you have some preference and the market moves so you can't get what you want, it happens to all of us -- but when people particularly bemoan newer technology as being unable to be maintained or upgraded or having built-in obsolescence... I have to wonder, why aren't they still using their 12 year old battery-swappable phone, upgrading their pin-compatible 486 motherboard, or driving their all-mechanical car from 1963.

toastercat 4y ago
Some people who would rather use their old phones don't because they can no longer receive software updates, either to the apps they use, or the OS. There are other reasons also like replacement parts are no longer easily available. But anyway, you're missing the forest for the trees. Most folks who bemoan what you speak of simply want the option to repair their items easily in the case that something does go wrong.
- throwawaylinux 4y ago
  > Some people who would rather use their old phones don't because they can no longer receive software updates, either to the apps they use, or the OS. You can though. Many old phones are hackable. > There are other reasons also like replacement parts are no longer easily available. Also doesn't seem to be true. You can still buy second hand parts and whole phones for old models for almost nothing. > But anyway, you're missing the forest for the trees. Most folks who bemoan what you speak of simply want the option to repair their items easily in the case that something does go wrong. You can likewise buy all parts for your 1963 Cadillac, you can buy manuals, you can repair it in a modestly equipped home-garage. Very few who complained about the computerization of cars do though, because new cars are so much more reliable and performant and relatively cheaper (in large part due to said computerization). It wasn't just a conspiracy to prevent people repairing their cars (the few who actually could repair their own cars back in the 60s even). I accept there are real valid concerns about repairability, planned obsolescence, etc. But like I said, a lot of complaints about this stuff is wide of the mark IMO. Having a phone with IR and headphone jack and SD cards and micro USB and replaceable screen and replaceable battery and upgradable RAM and pogo pins and physical keyboards and never-ending software updates sounds great. The reality is it will make it a much worse / more expensive product for the 99.999% of people who don't care for those features.
  - Schroedingersat 4y ago
    > You can though. Many old phones are hackable. Lineage doesn't help you update the NDA protected binary blob drivers
  - toastercat 4y ago
    > You can though. Many old phones are hackable. Many != All. For example, up-to-date custom ROMs of LineageOS do not exist for all phones. > Also doesn't seem to be true. You can still buy second hand parts and whole phones for old models for almost nothing. Chances are more likely that you'll find damaged used phones with drained batteries, or low quality Chinese replacement parts. Sorry, but it does seem to be true unless you're willing gamble money on questionable eBay listings. Personally, I've attempted to keep old phones from 2012 usable for my parents and older relatives, but it seems less and less viable as time goes by for the reasons I've already listed. Unfortunately, it's simply not as easy as you make it out to be. I use a newer phone (Pixel 5) that lacks a 3.5mm audio jack and removable battery. I accept that I may be on the fringe for wanting that audio jack (although I'm not sure what survey to look at to prove this), but I disagree that we as consumers are better off without it, or that it makes the phone more reliable/performant/worse.
pigeons 4y ago
We can't use our old battery-swappable (physical keyboard, headphone jacks, etc) phones because the networks they run on, which also run just fine (UMTS, CDMA2000, CDMAone, GSM, etc) have been shut down.
- throwawaylinux 4y ago
  Not many people did before those networks shut down, as far as I saw. You can get 3G phones with swappable battery and headphone jacks and physical keyboards too though, can't you?
  - wbsss4412 4y ago
    3G is being shut down in the US.

toastercat 4y ago

Some people who would rather use their old phones don't because they can no longer receive software updates, either to the apps they use, or the OS. There are other reasons also like replacement parts are no longer easily available. But anyway, you're missing the forest for the trees. Most folks who bemoan what you speak of simply want the option to repair their items easily in the case that something does go wrong.

throwawaylinux 4y ago
> Some people who would rather use their old phones don't because they can no longer receive software updates, either to the apps they use, or the OS. You can though. Many old phones are hackable. > There are other reasons also like replacement parts are no longer easily available. Also doesn't seem to be true. You can still buy second hand parts and whole phones for old models for almost nothing. > But anyway, you're missing the forest for the trees. Most folks who bemoan what you speak of simply want the option to repair their items easily in the case that something does go wrong. You can likewise buy all parts for your 1963 Cadillac, you can buy manuals, you can repair it in a modestly equipped home-garage. Very few who complained about the computerization of cars do though, because new cars are so much more reliable and performant and relatively cheaper (in large part due to said computerization). It wasn't just a conspiracy to prevent people repairing their cars (the few who actually could repair their own cars back in the 60s even). I accept there are real valid concerns about repairability, planned obsolescence, etc. But like I said, a lot of complaints about this stuff is wide of the mark IMO. Having a phone with IR and headphone jack and SD cards and micro USB and replaceable screen and replaceable battery and upgradable RAM and pogo pins and physical keyboards and never-ending software updates sounds great. The reality is it will make it a much worse / more expensive product for the 99.999% of people who don't care for those features.
- Schroedingersat 4y ago
  > You can though. Many old phones are hackable. Lineage doesn't help you update the NDA protected binary blob drivers
- toastercat 4y ago
  > You can though. Many old phones are hackable. Many != All. For example, up-to-date custom ROMs of LineageOS do not exist for all phones. > Also doesn't seem to be true. You can still buy second hand parts and whole phones for old models for almost nothing. Chances are more likely that you'll find damaged used phones with drained batteries, or low quality Chinese replacement parts. Sorry, but it does seem to be true unless you're willing gamble money on questionable eBay listings. Personally, I've attempted to keep old phones from 2012 usable for my parents and older relatives, but it seems less and less viable as time goes by for the reasons I've already listed. Unfortunately, it's simply not as easy as you make it out to be. I use a newer phone (Pixel 5) that lacks a 3.5mm audio jack and removable battery. I accept that I may be on the fringe for wanting that audio jack (although I'm not sure what survey to look at to prove this), but I disagree that we as consumers are better off without it, or that it makes the phone more reliable/performant/worse.

pigeons 4y ago

We can't use our old battery-swappable (physical keyboard, headphone jacks, etc) phones because the networks they run on, which also run just fine (UMTS, CDMA2000, CDMAone, GSM, etc) have been shut down.

throwawaylinux 4y ago
Not many people did before those networks shut down, as far as I saw. You can get 3G phones with swappable battery and headphone jacks and physical keyboards too though, can't you?
- wbsss4412 4y ago
  3G is being shut down in the US.