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> Putting a motor on each wheel — or at least one on each axle — could translate into hair-raising EV driving performance. I don't understand this. My Plaid Te

> Putting a motor on each wheel — or at least one on each axle — could translate into hair-raising EV driving performance. I don't understand this. My Plaid Tesla has a motor on each of the rear axles, and it's direct coupled to the wheel. The already are doing torque vectoring. Like all things in engineering, the trade-off's are critical. This article doesn't go at all into the pros/cons of the approach Tesla (and others) are doing as opposed to this approach. As a general rule, if Tesla isn't doing it already I suspect it's either not economically feasible, difficult to manufacture, or otherwise has drawbacks they've judged signifigant. ... with that said, bring on the competition. The whole world wins with every improvement to transport and electrification!

bombcar 4y ago
The idea of a motor on each wheel independent has obviously been considered, but what is often ignored is the sprung vs unsprung weight. You could develop a pretty amazing off-road vehicle with independent electric motors in each wheel, but it would be a relatively bumpy ride.
- chrisseaton 4y ago
  > You could develop a pretty amazing off-road vehicle with independent electric motors in each wheel, but it would be a relatively bumpy ride. Military EV prototypes are considering wheels-in-hubs, because they have complex suspension and because of under-armour, but yeah it means the motor is basically un-suspended.
  - _carbyau_ 4y ago
    sprung vs unsprung is a ratio. These vehicles are likely heavy enough that electric motors in the wheels might not change that ratio much. And swap/repair would be convenient!
    - bombcar 4y ago
      And at something like 10k pounds empty, and with army dudes in the cab who nobody cares about getting bumped, it might be the way to go.
- shrubble 4y ago
  The Mercedes 300SL, the Gull Wing of 1954, already had inboard-mounted brakes to reduce unpsrung weight. I would assume that any Mercedes engineer would be familiar with the concept...
  - Wistar 4y ago
    As do the Jaguar E and XJ types, and perhaps other Jags. The Audi 100, some Alfas and Lotus cars, too.
    - adolph 4y ago
      And the Humvee
  - jacquesm 4y ago
    Citroen DS as well: http://www.citroenet.org.uk/passenger-cars/michelin/ds/images/ds-brake.jpg http://www.citroenet.org.uk/passenger-cars/michelin/ds/image...
    - bigiain 4y ago
      And a bunch of Alfa Romeos (Suds and Sprints from the 80s/90s at least)
  - benj111 4y ago
    The 2cv did this as well. I'm undecided if this supports your argument though.
    - lloeki 4y ago
      Suspension design on the 2cv was a very specific consequence of the "egg" design brief: > This suspension design ensured the road wheels followed ground contours underneath them closely, while insulating the vehicle from shocks, enabling the 2CV to be driven over a ploughed field without breaking any eggs, as its design brief required. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citroën_2CV#Suspension https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citroën_2CV#Suspension
- rektide 4y ago
  The unspring weight is the main reason I havent placed an Aptera (also in-wheel axial motor) pre-order. I have a hard time imagining this fundamental of vehicle dynamics can be adequately worked around, but oh how I want to believe. Also keeping me from placing a pre-order; their pre-order site wouldnt let me check out in Firefox.
- impossiblefork 4y ago
  The unsprung weight won't be changed. There is one motor connected to each of the wheels, but there is a shaft between the wheel and the motor and a CV joint on this shaft, allowing the wheel to move relative to the motor, and the wheel is sprung. There are cars with in-wheel hub motors. For example, MW Motors make on of their Luka models with in-wheel hub motors. Those must keep their motors light, and have the advantage that you get more space in the car at the expense of a tiny bit more bumpiness.
- jillesvangurp 4y ago
  There are several cars that use this already. The issue is not so much ignored; but been dealt with. Multiple EV manufacturers have now successfully used this technology in vehicles. It seems the benefits outweigh the theoretical downsides. Of course the question remains what happens in a high performance car at extreme speeds. But presumably, Ferrari and Mercedes know what they are doing and have considered this as well. As for suspension; I'm sure there are ways to deal with that as well. I don't see how this should be any more bumpy than other vehicles for off-road. A bigger concern would be what you'd do in case of a flat tire as that basically means losing an engine. And when you are in the middle of nowhere, getting some road assistance would not be that easy.
  - benj111 4y ago
    You have the wheel separate to the motor, so you just replace the wheel? Just like you don't currently have to remove the brakes when you change a wheel.
    - jillesvangurp 4y ago
      Not if the motor is part of the wheel.
      - audunw 4y ago
        But it wouldn't be part of the wheel... there's no reason for it to be, and it'd make the car impossible to use in countries with snow where you need to change the wheel every spring and winter.
        kolinko 4y ago
        You change tires, not the whole wheels between seasons.
        benj111 4y ago
        Still, what tyre shop is set up to change tyres while still on the vehicle?
- chasd00 4y ago
  Don’t those giant mining dump trucks have electric motors on each wheel? Although that’s probably for the low rpm torque advantage like diesel electric trains.
  - bombcar 4y ago
    They do, primarily so they don't have to have anything resembling a "driveshaft" or a transmission, because they're so big they don't actually "bump" over anything, more like crush it into submission.
clouddrover 4y ago
> As a general rule, if Tesla isn't doing it already I suspect it's either not economically feasible, difficult to manufacture, or otherwise has drawbacks they've judged signifigant. That's not a very good rule. There a lots of things Tesla doesn't do. - Tesla doesn't do battery swaps, but NIO does. NIO's done it 10 million times: https://www.nio.com/blog/nio-users-china-have-completed-10-million-battery-swaps https://www.nio.com/blog/nio-users-china-have-completed-10-m... - Tesla doesn't do 350 kW chargers, but Ionity (among others) does. Current EV truck drivers appreciate it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UAttTG03WA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UAttTG03WA - Tesla's charging network is slowly rolling out charging to all EV brands in Europe, but Tesla still doesn't charge all brands in North America. Electrify America (among others) does. - Tesla doesn't offer EV scooters, but Gogoro (among others) does: https://www.gogoro.com/gogoro-network/ https://www.gogoro.com/gogoro-network/ - Tesla doesn't offer EV vans, but other manufacturers do. - Tesla doesn't offer EV city cars, but other manufacturers do. - Tesla doesn't do a heads-up display, but other manufacturers do. And so on.
- gridder 4y ago
  - Tesla doesn’t offer LiDAR sensors, even if it’s clearly the best technology to use for the autopilot.
  - awestroke 4y ago
    Because it is prohibitively expensive, and you get more data with multiple cameras than with one single lidar
    - clouddrover 4y ago
      It didn't prohibit Mercedes: https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a39966189/2022-mercedes-benz-eqs-drive-pilot-drive/ https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a39966189/2022-mercedes... https://electrek.co/2022/07/22/mercedes-drive-pilot-review/ https://electrek.co/2022/07/22/mercedes-drive-pilot-review/
      - 4y ago
deepGem 4y ago
If you use 1 motor per wheel, at full torque you don't have double the power but the same power as one motor on the axle. This is the fundamental disadvantage of using one motor for each wheel, which is probably why Tesla engineers didn't pursue this route. In addition, the extra weight also adds up, no matter how tiny the motor is. Essentially you are making each wheel heavier, adding to suspension woes. The greatest advantage of individual motors is in cornering when you can precisely control how much power each wheel gets, and obviously on icy surfaces when you can lower the power on the slipping wheel or disengage it completely and drive power from even one wheel which still has traction and grip. Nearly the same result can be obtained by torque vectoring, which is what Tesla employs. So for may be 20% less accuracy you can do away with the individual motors.
- benj111 4y ago
  >If you use 1 motor per wheel, at full torque you don't have double the power but the same power as one motor on the axle. That's like saying if you double the power of an engine you get the same power at the wheels? The limiting factor is the grip. The more power you add the more you get out until that limit is reached. But anyway, I'm not sure the one motor per wheel is all about more power. You could use 2 smaller motors instead of one large one. And then you can get rid of the axle and diff which are weighty items, so I don't think it's necssarily the heavier solution. Plus there's ground clearance. The diff is often the lowest point in an offroader. A motor at each wheel removes that limitation. Then you've got packaging. A centrally mounted motor uses space that could be used for cabin space or batteries. Hub motors are using otherwise dead space. Then there's reliability. If you lose one motor you've still got another to get you somewhere, and it's probably easier to replace too.
  - deepGem 4y ago
    Thank you. I oversaw the aspect of what happens until the motors reach max power and all the other aspects you have mentioned.
enragedcacti 4y ago
The Pros are volume and weight and the con is probably primarily price. Lower weight and volume means you have a lot more options on where they go and where you can put batteries that you couldn't before. In the article they mentioned the Koenegsegg Regera which is a perfect example of where this motor works well. A two-seater with an 1100HP V8 and 9kWh of battery that also needs world class handling makes weight and volume massively important and the MSRP of $4 million makes cost practically irrelevant. The Gemera is a bit different but is using the same motor tech and you can see how it allows them to pack things very tightly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwlNqaz9q_0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwlNqaz9q_0 For Tesla they already have a huge car with a battery design that works and a large area for the motors so re-engineering the S to make use of the space you save was probably not a good idea, especially when they are already building the roadster. I also wouldn't be surprised if its a bit of a Not-Invented-Here problem considering how much they value vertical integration.
- karamanolev 4y ago
  I don't think they're building the roadster in any capacity - at least haven't seen any evidence of that. What makes you think so?
  - enragedcacti 4y ago
    I should have said "designing" which there also isn't much evidence of but it seems fair to give them the benefit of the doubt that its at least real enough to drive category decisions for their other models.
alliao 4y ago
isn't Rivian shipping already with one motor on each wheel?
BoorishBears 4y ago
> if Tesla isn't doing it already I suspect it's either not economically feasible, difficult to manufacture, or otherwise has drawbacks they've judged signifigant. Which of those applied to giving the Plaid suitable rotors for its size and power?
NoPicklez 4y ago
With regards to your general rule statement. There has been a lot of discussion/reporting around the manufacturing and design of Tesla cars that is way behind that of the likes of Toyota, Nissan and Honda. The computer systems are state of the art, but in with regards to the design and manufacturing of its chassis, Tesla has been historically behind the times. Just because Tesla doesn’t do it, doesn’t mean it’s not the right way to go.
- ricw 4y ago
  That may have been the case 5 years ago, but these days it’s the opposite. Look at the Munro live Tesla tear downs on YouTube, particularly the megacastings structure, the battery packs or heat pumps. It’s night and day.
  - NoPicklez 4y ago
    That's great as Munro were the group who originally game them a bad wrap regarding their chassis design. My point still stands and it clearly shows that Tesla have room to improve, just like all car companies.
  - suction 4y ago
    Tesla quality is still lightyears behind old premium brands. Panel gaps so wide you could use them as kiddie pools. Their scrap rates are testament of how crappy their production process is.
    - beeboop 4y ago
      Do you have a source for Tesla's scrap rates and the scrap rates for other large manufacturers?
      - suction 4y ago
        In that dreaded plant in Germany it’s a cool 60% currently: https://www.google.com/amp/s/efahrer.chip.de/news/ueber-60-prozent-ausschuss-riesenpresse-schuld-an-problemen-bei-tesla-in-berlin_108858%3Flayout%3Damp https://www.google.com/amp/s/efahrer.chip.de/news/ueber-60-p...
jacquesm 4y ago
> My Plaid Tesla has a motor on each of the rear axles In car terminology you have only one rear axle (which is all of the unsprung weight in the back) and two driveshafts, I think you meant driveshaft (unless you have a six wheel Tesla...).
- benj111 4y ago
  Stub axles?
ezconnect 4y ago
If the motor is on the wheel it will have less torque and power. Unless there is a new technology motor that can rival a long fat motor in torque and power, I doubt we can see this in high performance electric vehicles. Small city cars on very short distance this is feasible because we gain a bit of space on a tiny car.
rsynnott 4y ago
> As a general rule, if Tesla isn't doing it already I suspect it's either not economically feasible, difficult to manufacture, or otherwise has drawbacks they've judged signifigant. This company really has made Jobs' reality distortion field pale in comparison. Without comment on the specific innovation in the article, it's a _very_ weird assumption that all innovation in a field would stem from one company. That's simply not how things generally work.
- texasbigdata 4y ago
  I think the reticence is the old attitude that you basically had to drag the old car manufacturers to electric, then they insisted on doing design after design of the clearly inferior hydrogen alternative, it's hard to take them seriously now that they're just responding to stay relevant / alive. If they really "cared" about EV this would have come 20 years earlier given the sheer scale of endowed resources they had. Of course that's not a fair evaluation of them, but one perspective on how it'd be easy to be cynical.
  - izacus 4y ago
    What a bizarre post - the "old" manufacturers have pretty much all released excellent EV cars across the market, many better than Tesla offerings in many ways. Why the wierd goalpost moving of having to do this 20 years ago?
    - texasbigdata 4y ago
      I'm not really familiar with this market but I'll just quote one article from last week suggesting it's a bit more lopsided than that; things can change quickly obviously. "Tesla accounts for more than two-thirds of all-electric car registrations (almost 68%), which is a dominant position, but the non-Tesla electric vehicle sales are growing at a similar rate and potentially might outpace Tesla later this year." If youre outselling everyone else _combined_ that suggests a clear current market winner. https://insideevs.com/news/604580/us-bev-premium-car-sales-2022h1/ https://insideevs.com/news/604580/us-bev-premium-car-sales-2...
automatic6131 4y ago
>As a general rule, if Tesla isn't doing it already I suspect it's either not economically feasible, difficult to manufacture, or otherwise has drawbacks they've judged signifigant. Why would you say something so wrong yet so bold?
Hypocritelefty 4y ago
jackmott 4y ago
suction 4y ago

bombcar 4y ago

The idea of a motor on each wheel independent has obviously been considered, but what is often ignored is the sprung vs unsprung weight. You could develop a pretty amazing off-road vehicle with independent electric motors in each wheel, but it would be a relatively bumpy ride.

chrisseaton 4y ago
> You could develop a pretty amazing off-road vehicle with independent electric motors in each wheel, but it would be a relatively bumpy ride. Military EV prototypes are considering wheels-in-hubs, because they have complex suspension and because of under-armour, but yeah it means the motor is basically un-suspended.
- _carbyau_ 4y ago
  sprung vs unsprung is a ratio. These vehicles are likely heavy enough that electric motors in the wheels might not change that ratio much. And swap/repair would be convenient!
  - bombcar 4y ago
    And at something like 10k pounds empty, and with army dudes in the cab who nobody cares about getting bumped, it might be the way to go.
shrubble 4y ago
The Mercedes 300SL, the Gull Wing of 1954, already had inboard-mounted brakes to reduce unpsrung weight. I would assume that any Mercedes engineer would be familiar with the concept...
- Wistar 4y ago
  As do the Jaguar E and XJ types, and perhaps other Jags. The Audi 100, some Alfas and Lotus cars, too.
  - adolph 4y ago
    And the Humvee
- jacquesm 4y ago
  Citroen DS as well: http://www.citroenet.org.uk/passenger-cars/michelin/ds/images/ds-brake.jpg http://www.citroenet.org.uk/passenger-cars/michelin/ds/image...
  - bigiain 4y ago
    And a bunch of Alfa Romeos (Suds and Sprints from the 80s/90s at least)
- benj111 4y ago
  The 2cv did this as well. I'm undecided if this supports your argument though.
  - lloeki 4y ago
    Suspension design on the 2cv was a very specific consequence of the "egg" design brief: > This suspension design ensured the road wheels followed ground contours underneath them closely, while insulating the vehicle from shocks, enabling the 2CV to be driven over a ploughed field without breaking any eggs, as its design brief required. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citroën_2CV#Suspension https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citroën_2CV#Suspension
rektide 4y ago
The unspring weight is the main reason I havent placed an Aptera (also in-wheel axial motor) pre-order. I have a hard time imagining this fundamental of vehicle dynamics can be adequately worked around, but oh how I want to believe. Also keeping me from placing a pre-order; their pre-order site wouldnt let me check out in Firefox.
impossiblefork 4y ago
The unsprung weight won't be changed. There is one motor connected to each of the wheels, but there is a shaft between the wheel and the motor and a CV joint on this shaft, allowing the wheel to move relative to the motor, and the wheel is sprung. There are cars with in-wheel hub motors. For example, MW Motors make on of their Luka models with in-wheel hub motors. Those must keep their motors light, and have the advantage that you get more space in the car at the expense of a tiny bit more bumpiness.
jillesvangurp 4y ago
There are several cars that use this already. The issue is not so much ignored; but been dealt with. Multiple EV manufacturers have now successfully used this technology in vehicles. It seems the benefits outweigh the theoretical downsides. Of course the question remains what happens in a high performance car at extreme speeds. But presumably, Ferrari and Mercedes know what they are doing and have considered this as well. As for suspension; I'm sure there are ways to deal with that as well. I don't see how this should be any more bumpy than other vehicles for off-road. A bigger concern would be what you'd do in case of a flat tire as that basically means losing an engine. And when you are in the middle of nowhere, getting some road assistance would not be that easy.
- benj111 4y ago
  You have the wheel separate to the motor, so you just replace the wheel? Just like you don't currently have to remove the brakes when you change a wheel.
  - jillesvangurp 4y ago
    Not if the motor is part of the wheel.
    - audunw 4y ago
      But it wouldn't be part of the wheel... there's no reason for it to be, and it'd make the car impossible to use in countries with snow where you need to change the wheel every spring and winter.
      - kolinko 4y ago
        You change tires, not the whole wheels between seasons.
        benj111 4y ago
        Still, what tyre shop is set up to change tyres while still on the vehicle?
chasd00 4y ago
Don’t those giant mining dump trucks have electric motors on each wheel? Although that’s probably for the low rpm torque advantage like diesel electric trains.
- bombcar 4y ago
  They do, primarily so they don't have to have anything resembling a "driveshaft" or a transmission, because they're so big they don't actually "bump" over anything, more like crush it into submission.

clouddrover 4y ago

> As a general rule, if Tesla isn't doing it already I suspect it's either not economically feasible, difficult to manufacture, or otherwise has drawbacks they've judged signifigant. That's not a very good rule. There a lots of things Tesla doesn't do. - Tesla doesn't do battery swaps, but NIO does. NIO's done it 10 million times: https://www.nio.com/blog/nio-users-china-have-completed-10-million-battery-swaps https://www.nio.com/blog/nio-users-china-have-completed-10-m... - Tesla doesn't do 350 kW chargers, but Ionity (among others) does. Current EV truck drivers appreciate it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UAttTG03WA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UAttTG03WA - Tesla's charging network is slowly rolling out charging to all EV brands in Europe, but Tesla still doesn't charge all brands in North America. Electrify America (among others) does. - Tesla doesn't offer EV scooters, but Gogoro (among others) does: https://www.gogoro.com/gogoro-network/ https://www.gogoro.com/gogoro-network/ - Tesla doesn't offer EV vans, but other manufacturers do. - Tesla doesn't offer EV city cars, but other manufacturers do. - Tesla doesn't do a heads-up display, but other manufacturers do. And so on.

gridder 4y ago
- Tesla doesn’t offer LiDAR sensors, even if it’s clearly the best technology to use for the autopilot.
- awestroke 4y ago
  Because it is prohibitively expensive, and you get more data with multiple cameras than with one single lidar
  - clouddrover 4y ago
    It didn't prohibit Mercedes: https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a39966189/2022-mercedes-benz-eqs-drive-pilot-drive/ https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a39966189/2022-mercedes... https://electrek.co/2022/07/22/mercedes-drive-pilot-review/ https://electrek.co/2022/07/22/mercedes-drive-pilot-review/
    - 4y ago

deepGem 4y ago

If you use 1 motor per wheel, at full torque you don't have double the power but the same power as one motor on the axle. This is the fundamental disadvantage of using one motor for each wheel, which is probably why Tesla engineers didn't pursue this route. In addition, the extra weight also adds up, no matter how tiny the motor is. Essentially you are making each wheel heavier, adding to suspension woes. The greatest advantage of individual motors is in cornering when you can precisely control how much power each wheel gets, and obviously on icy surfaces when you can lower the power on the slipping wheel or disengage it completely and drive power from even one wheel which still has traction and grip. Nearly the same result can be obtained by torque vectoring, which is what Tesla employs. So for may be 20% less accuracy you can do away with the individual motors.

benj111 4y ago
>If you use 1 motor per wheel, at full torque you don't have double the power but the same power as one motor on the axle. That's like saying if you double the power of an engine you get the same power at the wheels? The limiting factor is the grip. The more power you add the more you get out until that limit is reached. But anyway, I'm not sure the one motor per wheel is all about more power. You could use 2 smaller motors instead of one large one. And then you can get rid of the axle and diff which are weighty items, so I don't think it's necssarily the heavier solution. Plus there's ground clearance. The diff is often the lowest point in an offroader. A motor at each wheel removes that limitation. Then you've got packaging. A centrally mounted motor uses space that could be used for cabin space or batteries. Hub motors are using otherwise dead space. Then there's reliability. If you lose one motor you've still got another to get you somewhere, and it's probably easier to replace too.
- deepGem 4y ago
  Thank you. I oversaw the aspect of what happens until the motors reach max power and all the other aspects you have mentioned.

enragedcacti 4y ago

The Pros are volume and weight and the con is probably primarily price. Lower weight and volume means you have a lot more options on where they go and where you can put batteries that you couldn't before. In the article they mentioned the Koenegsegg Regera which is a perfect example of where this motor works well. A two-seater with an 1100HP V8 and 9kWh of battery that also needs world class handling makes weight and volume massively important and the MSRP of $4 million makes cost practically irrelevant. The Gemera is a bit different but is using the same motor tech and you can see how it allows them to pack things very tightly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwlNqaz9q_0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwlNqaz9q_0 For Tesla they already have a huge car with a battery design that works and a large area for the motors so re-engineering the S to make use of the space you save was probably not a good idea, especially when they are already building the roadster. I also wouldn't be surprised if its a bit of a Not-Invented-Here problem considering how much they value vertical integration.

karamanolev 4y ago
I don't think they're building the roadster in any capacity - at least haven't seen any evidence of that. What makes you think so?
- enragedcacti 4y ago
  I should have said "designing" which there also isn't much evidence of but it seems fair to give them the benefit of the doubt that its at least real enough to drive category decisions for their other models.

alliao 4y ago

isn't Rivian shipping already with one motor on each wheel?

BoorishBears 4y ago

> if Tesla isn't doing it already I suspect it's either not economically feasible, difficult to manufacture, or otherwise has drawbacks they've judged signifigant. Which of those applied to giving the Plaid suitable rotors for its size and power?

NoPicklez 4y ago

With regards to your general rule statement. There has been a lot of discussion/reporting around the manufacturing and design of Tesla cars that is way behind that of the likes of Toyota, Nissan and Honda. The computer systems are state of the art, but in with regards to the design and manufacturing of its chassis, Tesla has been historically behind the times. Just because Tesla doesn’t do it, doesn’t mean it’s not the right way to go.

ricw 4y ago
That may have been the case 5 years ago, but these days it’s the opposite. Look at the Munro live Tesla tear downs on YouTube, particularly the megacastings structure, the battery packs or heat pumps. It’s night and day.
- NoPicklez 4y ago
  That's great as Munro were the group who originally game them a bad wrap regarding their chassis design. My point still stands and it clearly shows that Tesla have room to improve, just like all car companies.
- suction 4y ago
  Tesla quality is still lightyears behind old premium brands. Panel gaps so wide you could use them as kiddie pools. Their scrap rates are testament of how crappy their production process is.
  - beeboop 4y ago
    Do you have a source for Tesla's scrap rates and the scrap rates for other large manufacturers?
    - suction 4y ago
      In that dreaded plant in Germany it’s a cool 60% currently: https://www.google.com/amp/s/efahrer.chip.de/news/ueber-60-prozent-ausschuss-riesenpresse-schuld-an-problemen-bei-tesla-in-berlin_108858%3Flayout%3Damp https://www.google.com/amp/s/efahrer.chip.de/news/ueber-60-p...

jacquesm 4y ago

> My Plaid Tesla has a motor on each of the rear axles In car terminology you have only one rear axle (which is all of the unsprung weight in the back) and two driveshafts, I think you meant driveshaft (unless you have a six wheel Tesla...).

benj111 4y ago
Stub axles?

ezconnect 4y ago

If the motor is on the wheel it will have less torque and power. Unless there is a new technology motor that can rival a long fat motor in torque and power, I doubt we can see this in high performance electric vehicles. Small city cars on very short distance this is feasible because we gain a bit of space on a tiny car.

rsynnott 4y ago

> As a general rule, if Tesla isn't doing it already I suspect it's either not economically feasible, difficult to manufacture, or otherwise has drawbacks they've judged signifigant. This company really has made Jobs' reality distortion field pale in comparison. Without comment on the specific innovation in the article, it's a _very_ weird assumption that all innovation in a field would stem from one company. That's simply not how things generally work.

texasbigdata 4y ago
I think the reticence is the old attitude that you basically had to drag the old car manufacturers to electric, then they insisted on doing design after design of the clearly inferior hydrogen alternative, it's hard to take them seriously now that they're just responding to stay relevant / alive. If they really "cared" about EV this would have come 20 years earlier given the sheer scale of endowed resources they had. Of course that's not a fair evaluation of them, but one perspective on how it'd be easy to be cynical.
- izacus 4y ago
  What a bizarre post - the "old" manufacturers have pretty much all released excellent EV cars across the market, many better than Tesla offerings in many ways. Why the wierd goalpost moving of having to do this 20 years ago?
  - texasbigdata 4y ago
    I'm not really familiar with this market but I'll just quote one article from last week suggesting it's a bit more lopsided than that; things can change quickly obviously. "Tesla accounts for more than two-thirds of all-electric car registrations (almost 68%), which is a dominant position, but the non-Tesla electric vehicle sales are growing at a similar rate and potentially might outpace Tesla later this year." If youre outselling everyone else _combined_ that suggests a clear current market winner. https://insideevs.com/news/604580/us-bev-premium-car-sales-2022h1/ https://insideevs.com/news/604580/us-bev-premium-car-sales-2...

automatic6131 4y ago

Hypocritelefty 4y ago

jackmott 4y ago

suction 4y ago