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> “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is lik

> “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.” Define love and define god. Some Christians have defined loving their neighbor as forcing gay people into barbaric gay conversion therapy. Some have defined it as taking young indigenous children from their families and raising them as good, civilized westerns to get the Indian out of them. God doesn't exist, so loving god with all your heart doesn't mean anything objectively. What "loving god" looks like is entirely subjective and there have been many opinions throughout history about what that means. Some interpretations have included sacrificing children. If there actually is a god, they doesn't seem to be very good about consistently telling us what they want and how they feel loved by us. The Bible has plenty of good passages, but also tons of bad ones. It's a fine piece of literature to study and get insight for your spiritual practice. But never forget, the Bible got the question of slavery wrong. Not even the new testament condemns slavery. This is not a good book.

generalizations 4y ago
> Define love and define god. The first definition is easier to find. > 4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
- v-erne 4y ago
  Each time I here this thing (this fragment from Corinthians) I cringe a little bit because many people uses this as a definition of love (hence its read at weddings here where I live) but at the same time this being part of holy book sounds like love is so fuzzy term that no one really knows what it means so it needs pseudo definition that is all over the place (and no, I do not have better definition for it - but I have good reason - I do not believe that it exists).
- bandyaboot 4y ago
  This is a list of behaviors one might expect to observe in the presence of “love”. The fact that it is commonly cited as the best definition of the word kind of proves gp’s point.
- aarpmcgee 4y ago
  This is not what love is. It is merely a list of words for qualities that are sometimes recognized while experiencing love.
comfypotato 4y ago
You use slavery as an example of what makes the Bible a bad book. My understanding is that the Bible generally condemns the modern notion of slavery (one in which the slaves have a viable alternative). The Jews’ slavery in Egypt, for example, is condemned. Slavery in first century Rome, for an opposing example, was often the result of the slaves having no other option (the society having no way to support them). It was effectively better than the alternative for the slaves, and there were routes to freedom. I’m curious about your thoughts. You say “it is not a good book” while I feel that the New Testament in particular is considered to promote good things. Obviously the classic atheist liberal’s “bad guys” in the uneducated rural conservative Christians have done sad things in the name of Jesus (like your aforementioned conversion therapy), but that’s people and not the book.
- v-erne 4y ago
  That's good defense of Bible but really there is only one problem with it (and with other holy books) - the nature of the term "holy book" prevents it from being made better. There are some good things in it (especially in New Testament), but this only means that it should be reedited and rewritten into something more modern and useful - but it can't because God apparently do not believe in second editions.
  - SAI_Peregrinus 4y ago
    The "holy book" being infallible is mostly a problem with the religions whose gods are so pathetically weak they can't make mistakes, or learn new things.
    - soco 4y ago
      The old Greek gods were very fallible yet people still submitted to them. Power dictates, with or without holy books.

generalizations 4y ago

> Define love and define god. The first definition is easier to find. > 4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

v-erne 4y ago
Each time I here this thing (this fragment from Corinthians) I cringe a little bit because many people uses this as a definition of love (hence its read at weddings here where I live) but at the same time this being part of holy book sounds like love is so fuzzy term that no one really knows what it means so it needs pseudo definition that is all over the place (and no, I do not have better definition for it - but I have good reason - I do not believe that it exists).
bandyaboot 4y ago
This is a list of behaviors one might expect to observe in the presence of “love”. The fact that it is commonly cited as the best definition of the word kind of proves gp’s point.
aarpmcgee 4y ago
This is not what love is. It is merely a list of words for qualities that are sometimes recognized while experiencing love.

comfypotato 4y ago

You use slavery as an example of what makes the Bible a bad book. My understanding is that the Bible generally condemns the modern notion of slavery (one in which the slaves have a viable alternative). The Jews’ slavery in Egypt, for example, is condemned. Slavery in first century Rome, for an opposing example, was often the result of the slaves having no other option (the society having no way to support them). It was effectively better than the alternative for the slaves, and there were routes to freedom. I’m curious about your thoughts. You say “it is not a good book” while I feel that the New Testament in particular is considered to promote good things. Obviously the classic atheist liberal’s “bad guys” in the uneducated rural conservative Christians have done sad things in the name of Jesus (like your aforementioned conversion therapy), but that’s people and not the book.

v-erne 4y ago
That's good defense of Bible but really there is only one problem with it (and with other holy books) - the nature of the term "holy book" prevents it from being made better. There are some good things in it (especially in New Testament), but this only means that it should be reedited and rewritten into something more modern and useful - but it can't because God apparently do not believe in second editions.
- SAI_Peregrinus 4y ago
  The "holy book" being infallible is mostly a problem with the religions whose gods are so pathetically weak they can't make mistakes, or learn new things.
  - soco 4y ago
    The old Greek gods were very fallible yet people still submitted to them. Power dictates, with or without holy books.