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Things like the Internet Archive have an opt-out process rather than opt-in. The extent to how the IA operates within the law isn't clear to me, but it does sug

Things like the Internet Archive have an opt-out process rather than opt-in. The extent to how the IA operates within the law isn't clear to me, but it does suggest that the case isn't as open-and-shut as you make it seem.

jyxent 4y ago
I think they are opt-out because Wayback Machine would be very incomplete if it required opting in. They are just willing to deal with legal issues that occur due to this policy. They have removed web sites before due to copyright claims and have a DMCA claim process.
- burntsushi 4y ago
  Whether the IA is incomplete or not doesn't sound like a legal argument though. My point is that this is not a black & white issue. :)
upupandup 4y ago
Bill Clinton signed the DMCA law into effect at the start of the internet boom because somebody could have power to shutdown a platform because their doodle got shared. Then they could go after the host, and even the software providers. To prevent these recursive litigations that could easily have malicious intent (competition uploading copyright material to your platform to shut you down), the DMCA safe harbour was born. Internet Archive operates the same way, if they receive DMCA notice, they need to comply in order to keep the safe harbour process. As to whether WTL will file a DMCA to take down his material, it looks unlikely. For whatever reason he suddenly wanted to be out of limelight and I get the feeling that he doesn't care much whether his work is shared or not but who knows, maybe he will come out of the woodwork to raise his voice (which would be in contrast to his reclusive state). He really is a mysterious figure and even more mysterious is the sheer amount of effort he put into his work and passion to share it suddenly relinquished overnight, out of whim? stress? depression? We can only guess.
- burntsushi 4y ago
  Yes, and I think this runs counter to the parent poster I was responding to claiming that things like the IA "can't" do what they've been doing for decades. They can. And the people hosting this web site can do it too. They might get a DMCA notice, absolutely, in which case, maybe they'll still be able to host the content. It's a grey area. The parent poster was speaking in very clear absolutes and thus, IMO, misrepresenting the situation.
pessimizer 4y ago
And their opt-out policy for books was ended after their extremely-optimistic ploy to parlay becoming America's covid library into a general weakening of copyrights. I don't even know if they have an opt-in process for the copyright holders of books.
- burntsushi 4y ago
  Yes I'm aware. But opt-out remains for web sites, which are also copyrighted. The difference is that books had a powerful entity arguing their case. So I think my point stands.

jyxent 4y ago

I think they are opt-out because Wayback Machine would be very incomplete if it required opting in. They are just willing to deal with legal issues that occur due to this policy. They have removed web sites before due to copyright claims and have a DMCA claim process.

burntsushi 4y ago
Whether the IA is incomplete or not doesn't sound like a legal argument though. My point is that this is not a black & white issue. :)

upupandup 4y ago

Bill Clinton signed the DMCA law into effect at the start of the internet boom because somebody could have power to shutdown a platform because their doodle got shared. Then they could go after the host, and even the software providers. To prevent these recursive litigations that could easily have malicious intent (competition uploading copyright material to your platform to shut you down), the DMCA safe harbour was born. Internet Archive operates the same way, if they receive DMCA notice, they need to comply in order to keep the safe harbour process. As to whether WTL will file a DMCA to take down his material, it looks unlikely. For whatever reason he suddenly wanted to be out of limelight and I get the feeling that he doesn't care much whether his work is shared or not but who knows, maybe he will come out of the woodwork to raise his voice (which would be in contrast to his reclusive state). He really is a mysterious figure and even more mysterious is the sheer amount of effort he put into his work and passion to share it suddenly relinquished overnight, out of whim? stress? depression? We can only guess.

burntsushi 4y ago
Yes, and I think this runs counter to the parent poster I was responding to claiming that things like the IA "can't" do what they've been doing for decades. They can. And the people hosting this web site can do it too. They might get a DMCA notice, absolutely, in which case, maybe they'll still be able to host the content. It's a grey area. The parent poster was speaking in very clear absolutes and thus, IMO, misrepresenting the situation.

pessimizer 4y ago

And their opt-out policy for books was ended after their extremely-optimistic ploy to parlay becoming America's covid library into a general weakening of copyrights. I don't even know if they have an opt-in process for the copyright holders of books.

burntsushi 4y ago
Yes I'm aware. But opt-out remains for web sites, which are also copyrighted. The difference is that books had a powerful entity arguing their case. So I think my point stands.