3 ms·

No, they are not right about the attitude. We just don't do proprietary software and so discussing it on our channels is off topic and distracting. "Go fuck y

by rekado 4y ago

No, they are not right about the attitude. We just don't do proprietary software and so discussing it on our channels is off topic and distracting. "Go fuck yourself" is much stronger, much ruder attitude. On the #guix IRC channel you'll often get a private message to direct you to other channels where it's fine to discuss proprietary software and how to make it work on Guix.

xyzzy_plugh 4y ago
I'm not attempting to construe that the attitude is GFY. From the perspective of someone who is enjoying this tool and ecosystem and wants to do something, but the community is trying very hard to enforce beliefs that are incompatible, it sure tastes like I'm being told to go fuck myself. Does it feel good to you when you ask a question and the reply you get is "this isn't for you"? Requiring a private reply on an IRC server to unblock a comically common use case is exactly the problem I am trying to highlight.
- rekado 4y ago
  "enforce beliefs"? No. Proprietary software simply isn't part of the project and discussing stuff that are besides the project goals on project channels is not welcome. You don't have to belief anything to use Guix or participate in the community. It's an odd sense of entitlement to demand that others accept, accommodate, and welcome your ideology in dealings with you. I also find it strange that you ascribe "this isn't for you" (a comment made here by strangers) to the project. No wonder then that you interpret entirely harmless community guidelines as if someone told you "to go fuck [your]self".
  - xyzzy_plugh 4y ago
    > Proprietary software simply isn't part of the project and discussing stuff that are besides the project goals on project channels is not welcome. Yes, and I believe that this attitude harms community building, education and adoption efforts. You specifically use the words "not welcome". Other, more welcoming projects typically don't use such language outside of a Code of Conduct policy document. I'm pointing out that I've been made to feel unwelcome and you're saying that is entirely harmless. Do you see the problem?
    - rekado 4y ago
      I don't think we're coming to an understanding. You're (inadvertently?) twisting the phrase "not welcome", which I apply to behavior, to make it apply to people. If we can't agree on how to apply words we cannot use them to approach understanding.

by rekado 4y ago

xyzzy_plugh 4y ago

I'm not attempting to construe that the attitude is GFY. From the perspective of someone who is enjoying this tool and ecosystem and wants to do something, but the community is trying very hard to enforce beliefs that are incompatible, it sure tastes like I'm being told to go fuck myself. Does it feel good to you when you ask a question and the reply you get is "this isn't for you"? Requiring a private reply on an IRC server to unblock a comically common use case is exactly the problem I am trying to highlight.

rekado 4y ago
"enforce beliefs"? No. Proprietary software simply isn't part of the project and discussing stuff that are besides the project goals on project channels is not welcome. You don't have to belief anything to use Guix or participate in the community. It's an odd sense of entitlement to demand that others accept, accommodate, and welcome your ideology in dealings with you. I also find it strange that you ascribe "this isn't for you" (a comment made here by strangers) to the project. No wonder then that you interpret entirely harmless community guidelines as if someone told you "to go fuck [your]self".
- xyzzy_plugh 4y ago
  > Proprietary software simply isn't part of the project and discussing stuff that are besides the project goals on project channels is not welcome. Yes, and I believe that this attitude harms community building, education and adoption efforts. You specifically use the words "not welcome". Other, more welcoming projects typically don't use such language outside of a Code of Conduct policy document. I'm pointing out that I've been made to feel unwelcome and you're saying that is entirely harmless. Do you see the problem?
  - rekado 4y ago
    I don't think we're coming to an understanding. You're (inadvertently?) twisting the phrase "not welcome", which I apply to behavior, to make it apply to people. If we can't agree on how to apply words we cannot use them to approach understanding.