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Ya, good question. This stuff is confusing and no one explains it properly. With a DRE (eg a touchscreen) the legal ballot is the memory card. The VVPAT is lik
by specialist 4y ago
Ya, good question. This stuff is confusing and no one explains it properly.
With a DRE (eg a touchscreen) the legal ballot is the memory card. The VVPAT is like a log file printed to a cash register paper roll. VVPATs are not the legal ballot of record. Nor are they used for tabulation. Some jurisdictions may use the VVPAT for recounts or audits, but I wouldn't know. In other words, "Voter Verified Paper Audit Trail" is a lie; It's not used for auditing, and most voters don't even look at it.
The implementation of VVPAT isn't really intended for tabulation. It's thermal paper, easily damaged. There's no standardized format. There's no gear for scanning it. The content doesn't even look like a ballot.
Also, with the Australian ballot system, private voting and public counting, there are no receipts. (Whether or not DREs and postal ballots qualify as Australian ballots is another discussion.)
I think maybe a ballot marking device (BMD) would fit your goals. The UX is like a DRE. But a BMD generates an actual ballot. That is then treated like any other ballot, fed into a separate tabulator. BMDs do not tabulate.
I think BMDs are great. I'd bet that every election integrity activist would agree.
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Every statement I make should include a "YMMV" caveat. Every jurisdiction (state, county) can potentially do their own thing. Worse, the details (gear, laws, rules, procedures) keep changing. So there's always a lot of thrashing getting everyone onto the same page.
Please keep asking questions. None of this stuff is intuitive, or works how people expect. It took me years of intense effort to get up to speed, which shouldn't be the case.
- legitster 4y ago> Some jurisdictions may use the VVPAT for recounts or audits, but I wouldn't know. I don't understand your statement. You say you don't know if it's used for auditing... then you claim decisively it's not used for auditing? > There's no standardized format. There's no gear for scanning it. That's exactly the point - you are only looking at these by hand in the case of a recount? Again, if I am trying to perpetrate voter fraud, enough to change an election, how do I do it with a VVPAT? Do I change their answer and hope that no one notices their vote got changed on their receipt? Or send a different answer to tabulation that would be caught in the event of a recount? Both of these possibilities seem no different than a BMD. How do I know the tabulator machines themselves are not compromised? It seems like a weird distinction to trust one but not the other. https://www.pewtrusts.org/~/media/legacy/uploadedfiles/wwwpewtrustsorg/reports/election_reform/ERIPBrief1005pdf.pdf https://www.pewtrusts.org/~/media/legacy/uploadedfiles/wwwpe...