4 ms·

I can't agree with this at all. We have plenty of modern examples that show this to not be the case: West Germany versus East Germany, South Korea versus North

I can't agree with this at all. We have plenty of modern examples that show this to not be the case: West Germany versus East Germany, South Korea versus North Korea, Taiwan versus China. In all these examples less oppressions results in a stronger economy and a higher standard of living for citizens.

dirtyid 4y ago
West Germany was marshal planned by US at height of economic primacy and was previously developed which made recovery to prior levels possible. SK and TW were both bloody authoritarian govs sponsored by US (for coldwar containment) who had industrial policies, again supported by US at height of economic primacy. As far as I'm aware, there are zero countries that has ever successfully developed without initial phase of authoritarianism / wide scale abuse - europeans had their colonies, US her slaves - it's basically a prerequisite. The second requirement being either on the good books and gaining the support of reigning hegemons or at least not be actively contained by them (East Germany). Historically, developing countries simply require massive repression (and the occasional dose of cultural genocide) to establish stable national identities and enviroments where people behave like good cogs in the machine to build up the material conditions to enable less opression / more liberalization for later generations. Authoritarianism is the worst form of government for developement... except for all the others that have been tried.
- WitCanStain 4y ago
  What about Finland? Very poor in the 1800s, rapidly industrialised and became wealthy in the 20th century. They did have a civil war but I'm not quite sure that counts as oppression by itself.
  - dirtyid 4y ago
    My understanding of Finnish history is rough but from what I understand Finland was also industrialized in late 1800s as Russian Dutchy under Alexander II's reforms. IIRC reward for being loyal unlike uprising in crimea and poland. It got the benefits of empire. Granted much slower than rest of Europe due to geography. Civil war over russification not unlike purges in SKorean or Taiwan/ROC, at the end of the day you need get the population in line under a national identity either through ideology or coercsion so they can focus on development instead of be distracted by sectarian drama.

dirtyid 4y ago

West Germany was marshal planned by US at height of economic primacy and was previously developed which made recovery to prior levels possible. SK and TW were both bloody authoritarian govs sponsored by US (for coldwar containment) who had industrial policies, again supported by US at height of economic primacy. As far as I'm aware, there are zero countries that has ever successfully developed without initial phase of authoritarianism / wide scale abuse - europeans had their colonies, US her slaves - it's basically a prerequisite. The second requirement being either on the good books and gaining the support of reigning hegemons or at least not be actively contained by them (East Germany). Historically, developing countries simply require massive repression (and the occasional dose of cultural genocide) to establish stable national identities and enviroments where people behave like good cogs in the machine to build up the material conditions to enable less opression / more liberalization for later generations. Authoritarianism is the worst form of government for developement... except for all the others that have been tried.

WitCanStain 4y ago
What about Finland? Very poor in the 1800s, rapidly industrialised and became wealthy in the 20th century. They did have a civil war but I'm not quite sure that counts as oppression by itself.
- dirtyid 4y ago
  My understanding of Finnish history is rough but from what I understand Finland was also industrialized in late 1800s as Russian Dutchy under Alexander II's reforms. IIRC reward for being loyal unlike uprising in crimea and poland. It got the benefits of empire. Granted much slower than rest of Europe due to geography. Civil war over russification not unlike purges in SKorean or Taiwan/ROC, at the end of the day you need get the population in line under a national identity either through ideology or coercsion so they can focus on development instead of be distracted by sectarian drama.