5 ms·

That's a thought you're free to have, but it isn't really relevant to the article - the Department of Agriculture is the agency that prohibits this, for reasons

That's a thought you're free to have, but it isn't really relevant to the article - the Department of Agriculture is the agency that prohibits this, for reasons related to potential damage to US livestock - African swine fever and foot-and-mouth disease are specifically mentioned. There is no implication in the article that this stuff is unsafe to consume by humans.

stickfigure 4y ago
Given how heavily processed bologna is, I'm going to call bullshit on that. A more likely reason is that domestic pork producers have a powerful lobby.
- googlryas 4y ago
  L. monocytogenes is found all the time in processed meats coming out of highly regulated plants in the US. I hope you understand that "processed" does not mean that all viruses and bacteria have been removed or killed from the product. Especially when the meat is processed in a plant with even laxer safety standards than what we have in America.
  - stickfigure 4y ago
    You're basically making @citrin_ru's point - "nation of germophobes", not "potential damage to livestock".
    - googlryas 4y ago
      I'm not making their point by telling you that you're incorrect in saying that "processed food = no potential disease transmissibility".
      - stickfigure 4y ago
        Nobody is arguing that it's impossible to get sick from bologna. However, bologna is not a vector for african swine fever or foot-and-mouth disease or (as far as I can tell) any other threat to US livestock. Thus "bullshit". Re-read the thread.
        soledades 4y ago
        really into this thread now. what does bologna being heavily processed have to do with "bullshit" though?
        googlryas 4y ago
        You said "Given how heavily processed bologna is, I'm going to call bullshit on that" in response to someone who said "the Department of Agriculture is the agency that prohibits this, for reasons related to potential damage to US livestock - African swine fever and foot-and-mouth disease are specifically mentioned." Why would you say that instead of "bologna is not a vector for african swine fever or foot-and-mouth disease"? What does how heavily processed the bologna have to do with your point, and why did you bring it up if it has nothing to do with it? That's literally the only thing I argued against.
  - atwood22 4y ago
    Processed meats usually have preservatives like nitrates or nitrites in them. It doesn't matter what bacteria is detectable when the meat leaves the factory. The bacteria are not going to propagate in the meat.
    - galleywest200 4y ago
      My cold cuts that expired in my fridge beg to differ.
      - chrisseaton 4y ago
        Heavily processed (reformed) meat is different to a simple cold cut of cooked meat.
        MichaelCollins 4y ago
        "Cold cuts" encompasses all manner of sliced meats, including bologna. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunch_meat#Types https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunch_meat#Types
- II2II 4y ago
  I'm not sure what the situation is in the US, but farmers north of the border get upset when their livestock is ordered to be destroyed due to disease. So yeah, there is probably lobbying. It's simply not for the reasons implied. The article touched upon other illegal imports due to invasive species, such as wood products. I doubt that there is a wood carver's lobby that is trying to have the work of foreign craftsmen banned. They don't need such a lobby since once an alien species (or disease) gets a foothold it is near impossible to stop and very difficult to slow.
  - markdown 4y ago
    > The article touched upon other illegal imports due to invasive species Import of plants into the US is completely unregulated, which is why fruit trees and interesting plants from all over the world are available in the US. It's because inbound international mail isn't inspected, which isn't the case in most other countries.
    - sithadmin 4y ago
      Both of your statements are false. Things slip through cracks, but there's an extensive amount of enforcement effort that goes into regulating and restricting entry of plants into the US. Further, of course inbound international parcels are inspected [1]. As with any sort of border inspection, USPS and CBP rely on random samples and targeted efforts of limited scope. [1]https://www.uspsoig.gov/document/prohibited-inbound-international-mailings https://www.uspsoig.gov/document/prohibited-inbound-internat...
      - markdown 4y ago
        There are more types of fruit trees in the US than in any other country. I'm active on fruit tree enthusiast forums where members buy seeds online from every corner of the world. They are never inspected. By comparison, I have to open every single package I import in front of a customs agent, and I live in a third world country. This is after they've been x-rayed by customs. I mean, just recently Americans all over the country were receiving seeds in the mail from overseas and your govt had to issue warnings. Such warnings would be unnecessary in my country because every package is inspected. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/aug/03/mystery-seeds-mail-what-are-they-americans https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/aug/03/mystery-seed... Millions upon millions of packages arrive into your country every week from Aliexpress and other foreign online marketplaces. None of these are inspected.
ciceryadam 4y ago
European pig farms are culled after the first confirmed African swine fever, or foot-and-mouth disease occurrence. Carcasses of wild pigs and boars are tested for these diseases too, and if they find an occurrence in the region, they will test every farm in that region. If you have a pig at your private farm, you are obliged to give some samples to a veterinarian for tests as well (and it's funded by the government). I would say that EU and Japanese veterinary norms are much stricter then US ones, but you still cannot import much of the food products from here.

stickfigure 4y ago

Given how heavily processed bologna is, I'm going to call bullshit on that. A more likely reason is that domestic pork producers have a powerful lobby.

googlryas 4y ago
L. monocytogenes is found all the time in processed meats coming out of highly regulated plants in the US. I hope you understand that "processed" does not mean that all viruses and bacteria have been removed or killed from the product. Especially when the meat is processed in a plant with even laxer safety standards than what we have in America.
- stickfigure 4y ago
  You're basically making @citrin_ru's point - "nation of germophobes", not "potential damage to livestock".
  - googlryas 4y ago
    I'm not making their point by telling you that you're incorrect in saying that "processed food = no potential disease transmissibility".
    - stickfigure 4y ago
      Nobody is arguing that it's impossible to get sick from bologna. However, bologna is not a vector for african swine fever or foot-and-mouth disease or (as far as I can tell) any other threat to US livestock. Thus "bullshit". Re-read the thread.
      - soledades 4y ago
        really into this thread now. what does bologna being heavily processed have to do with "bullshit" though?
      - googlryas 4y ago
        You said "Given how heavily processed bologna is, I'm going to call bullshit on that" in response to someone who said "the Department of Agriculture is the agency that prohibits this, for reasons related to potential damage to US livestock - African swine fever and foot-and-mouth disease are specifically mentioned." Why would you say that instead of "bologna is not a vector for african swine fever or foot-and-mouth disease"? What does how heavily processed the bologna have to do with your point, and why did you bring it up if it has nothing to do with it? That's literally the only thing I argued against.
- atwood22 4y ago
  Processed meats usually have preservatives like nitrates or nitrites in them. It doesn't matter what bacteria is detectable when the meat leaves the factory. The bacteria are not going to propagate in the meat.
  - galleywest200 4y ago
    My cold cuts that expired in my fridge beg to differ.
    - chrisseaton 4y ago
      Heavily processed (reformed) meat is different to a simple cold cut of cooked meat.
      - MichaelCollins 4y ago
        "Cold cuts" encompasses all manner of sliced meats, including bologna. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunch_meat#Types https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunch_meat#Types
II2II 4y ago
I'm not sure what the situation is in the US, but farmers north of the border get upset when their livestock is ordered to be destroyed due to disease. So yeah, there is probably lobbying. It's simply not for the reasons implied. The article touched upon other illegal imports due to invasive species, such as wood products. I doubt that there is a wood carver's lobby that is trying to have the work of foreign craftsmen banned. They don't need such a lobby since once an alien species (or disease) gets a foothold it is near impossible to stop and very difficult to slow.
- markdown 4y ago
  > The article touched upon other illegal imports due to invasive species Import of plants into the US is completely unregulated, which is why fruit trees and interesting plants from all over the world are available in the US. It's because inbound international mail isn't inspected, which isn't the case in most other countries.
  - sithadmin 4y ago
    Both of your statements are false. Things slip through cracks, but there's an extensive amount of enforcement effort that goes into regulating and restricting entry of plants into the US. Further, of course inbound international parcels are inspected [1]. As with any sort of border inspection, USPS and CBP rely on random samples and targeted efforts of limited scope. [1]https://www.uspsoig.gov/document/prohibited-inbound-international-mailings https://www.uspsoig.gov/document/prohibited-inbound-internat...
    - markdown 4y ago
      There are more types of fruit trees in the US than in any other country. I'm active on fruit tree enthusiast forums where members buy seeds online from every corner of the world. They are never inspected. By comparison, I have to open every single package I import in front of a customs agent, and I live in a third world country. This is after they've been x-rayed by customs. I mean, just recently Americans all over the country were receiving seeds in the mail from overseas and your govt had to issue warnings. Such warnings would be unnecessary in my country because every package is inspected. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/aug/03/mystery-seeds-mail-what-are-they-americans https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/aug/03/mystery-seed... Millions upon millions of packages arrive into your country every week from Aliexpress and other foreign online marketplaces. None of these are inspected.

ciceryadam 4y ago

European pig farms are culled after the first confirmed African swine fever, or foot-and-mouth disease occurrence. Carcasses of wild pigs and boars are tested for these diseases too, and if they find an occurrence in the region, they will test every farm in that region. If you have a pig at your private farm, you are obliged to give some samples to a veterinarian for tests as well (and it's funded by the government). I would say that EU and Japanese veterinary norms are much stricter then US ones, but you still cannot import much of the food products from here.