4 ms·

Of course they have the same root and etymology. Of course they do not have the same meaning, look them up in the dictionary. A private parking spot is not a pr

by anyfoo 4y ago

Of course they have the same root and etymology. Of course they do not have the same meaning, look them up in the dictionary. A private parking spot is not a privacy parking spot.

astrange 4y ago
This reminds me of the people who think public companies (traded on the stock market) are publicly owned (part of the government) and so want the First Amendment to apply to getting banned from Facebook.
Maursault 4y ago
They are strongly associated, and the definitions are related. One can not have a private conversation without privacy, and when seeking privacy it is exclusively to do something in private. Contrary to previous claims, one implies the other. The argument that privacy doesn't mean private, and vice versa, in regards to the meaning any of the letters in acronyms is specious, such as, the word private in VPN does not mean that you will have privacy, because, in fact, any transfer of data between the VPN nodes will be kept private from the Internet at large, thus the transfer is in privacy. The fallacy you and OP committed (if you are not OP, didn't check) is known as the appeal to definition.
- anyfoo 4y ago
  > One can not have a private conversation without privacy, and when seeking privacy it is exclusively to do something in private. One can have a private parking spot without privacy, though. Or a private pilot license. > any transfer of data between the VPN nodes will be kept private from the Internet at large, thus the transfer is in privacy Not if your VPN is not encrypted, which exists, although it isn't very common anymore, for obvious reasons. The IP address "10.1.1.1" is still part of IANA's private IP address space, no matter whether it is transported in a way (say using an unecrypted tunnel over the public Internet) that provides privacy or not.
  - Maursault 4y ago
    > One can have a private parking spot without privacy, though. Or a private pilot license. This is equivocating between two distinct and separate definitions of "private." You are mixing these homonyms. In the sense you're using in the quote I pulled from your comment, it means intended for or restricted to the use of a particular person, group, or class, but in the sense that it is used in Virtual Private Network, it means something else, namely not known or intended to be known publicly; secret.
    - anyfoo 4y ago
      Settling that question was the entire discussion you butted into. I quoted an RFC from the late 90s that shows what meaning of "private" was originally intended, while you seem to a priori assume what "private" means here. > in the sense that it is used in Virtual Private Network, it means something else, namely not known or intended to be known publicly; secret. Great. Present some evidence or stop wasting time. My evidence that it actually does not mean that is RFC2547.
      - Maursault 4y ago
        > My evidence that it actually does not mean that is RFC2547. RFC2547 does not support your claim... anywhere. I'll use Webster's definitions for my evidence. Also, every explanation of what VPN is everywhere on the Internet speaks of anonymity and privacy. This means the P in VPN could only mean free from public attention, secret and NOT for the use of a particular person or group, as in private parking.
        anyfoo 4y ago
        RFC2547 supports my claim that a VPN does not imply privacy. There is only one mention of "encryption", and it's called out as optional: A security-conscious VPN user might want to ensure that some or all of the packets which traverse the backbone are authenticated and/or encrypted. Webster's definition of a VPN is (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/VPN https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/VPN): a private computer network that functions over a public network A private network at the time was defined according to RFC1918. It also provides the motivation for private networks/the private IP address space, which was growth, not privacy/secrecy. It's a happy coincidence that you can sell a "Virtual Private Network" to endusers as a privacy-enhancing machination, given that it already contains the word "Private", even if that was meant as in private parking space, not private conversation.

by anyfoo 4y ago

Of course they have the same root and etymology. Of course they do not have the same meaning, look them up in the dictionary. A private parking spot is not a privacy parking spot.

astrange 4y ago

This reminds me of the people who think public companies (traded on the stock market) are publicly owned (part of the government) and so want the First Amendment to apply to getting banned from Facebook.

Maursault 4y ago

They are strongly associated, and the definitions are related. One can not have a private conversation without privacy, and when seeking privacy it is exclusively to do something in private. Contrary to previous claims, one implies the other. The argument that privacy doesn't mean private, and vice versa, in regards to the meaning any of the letters in acronyms is specious, such as, the word private in VPN does not mean that you will have privacy, because, in fact, any transfer of data between the VPN nodes will be kept private from the Internet at large, thus the transfer is in privacy. The fallacy you and OP committed (if you are not OP, didn't check) is known as the appeal to definition.

anyfoo 4y ago
> One can not have a private conversation without privacy, and when seeking privacy it is exclusively to do something in private. One can have a private parking spot without privacy, though. Or a private pilot license. > any transfer of data between the VPN nodes will be kept private from the Internet at large, thus the transfer is in privacy Not if your VPN is not encrypted, which exists, although it isn't very common anymore, for obvious reasons. The IP address "10.1.1.1" is still part of IANA's private IP address space, no matter whether it is transported in a way (say using an unecrypted tunnel over the public Internet) that provides privacy or not.
- Maursault 4y ago
  > One can have a private parking spot without privacy, though. Or a private pilot license. This is equivocating between two distinct and separate definitions of "private." You are mixing these homonyms. In the sense you're using in the quote I pulled from your comment, it means intended for or restricted to the use of a particular person, group, or class, but in the sense that it is used in Virtual Private Network, it means something else, namely not known or intended to be known publicly; secret.
  - anyfoo 4y ago
    Settling that question was the entire discussion you butted into. I quoted an RFC from the late 90s that shows what meaning of "private" was originally intended, while you seem to a priori assume what "private" means here. > in the sense that it is used in Virtual Private Network, it means something else, namely not known or intended to be known publicly; secret. Great. Present some evidence or stop wasting time. My evidence that it actually does not mean that is RFC2547.
    - Maursault 4y ago
      > My evidence that it actually does not mean that is RFC2547. RFC2547 does not support your claim... anywhere. I'll use Webster's definitions for my evidence. Also, every explanation of what VPN is everywhere on the Internet speaks of anonymity and privacy. This means the P in VPN could only mean free from public attention, secret and NOT for the use of a particular person or group, as in private parking.
      - anyfoo 4y ago
        RFC2547 supports my claim that a VPN does not imply privacy. There is only one mention of "encryption", and it's called out as optional: A security-conscious VPN user might want to ensure that some or all of the packets which traverse the backbone are authenticated and/or encrypted. Webster's definition of a VPN is (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/VPN https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/VPN): a private computer network that functions over a public network A private network at the time was defined according to RFC1918. It also provides the motivation for private networks/the private IP address space, which was growth, not privacy/secrecy. It's a happy coincidence that you can sell a "Virtual Private Network" to endusers as a privacy-enhancing machination, given that it already contains the word "Private", even if that was meant as in private parking space, not private conversation.