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Both of your examples are software related. In my experience, anything hardware related Apple tends to shift the blame to the consumer. I wonder how much of the

Both of your examples are software related. In my experience, anything hardware related Apple tends to shift the blame to the consumer. I wonder how much of their profits are based on repairs.

Handytinge 4y ago
It's also worth noting he's in Australia, where sane consumer laws exist that Apple have to operate in. The staff here are pretty good.
rootusrootus 4y ago
I think it's perhaps more random than that. Friend of mine had a problem with an older MBP. He took it in to get repaired, it was going to be a system board replacement, but since they didn't have that part handy they just sent him out with a brand new MBP with comparable (but slightly better) specs than his original. For all the people complaining about Apple, they haven't screwed me over yet either, I've only had good experiences. All hardware, I haven't had a software issue I couldn't find the fix for on my own.
- Bilal_io 4y ago
  I assume your friend had Apple Care, in which case it would be expected to receive a replacement device if they cannot repair it or cannot repair it in a timely manner.
  - rootusrootus 4y ago
    He did, but it was out of AppleCare too. The kicker was that the problem had begun to manifest while still within the three year window, so there was documented history. It was most of a year out of AppleCare when it failed the last time and they decided to cover it as goodwill.
pier25 4y ago
In my experience when there are design flaws Apple won't move a finger until there are class action lawsuits. And good luck if you're outside the US. Not sure how it is in other countries, but in Mexico Apple doesn't do repairs. It's all left to authorized third parties that really will only try to get as much money from you as possible or get you to buy a new device. I know a couple of people that were denied repairs/replacements on the infamous butterfly keyboards because these repair centers said they couldn't reproduce the issue themselves. Most likely they didn't want to do the repairs because their margin was too low.
inferiorhuman 4y ago
Anyone who's read my comments knows I don't usually have the patience to be charming or whatever. I had a battery start bulging with a polycarbonate MacBook and they just gave me a battery off the shelf no questions asked. There was some other underlying problem, and I eventually scrapped it. Its replacement eventually heated up the charging cable enough that the insulation browned and flaked away (computer side so it's not replaceable). I got a free replacement with zero hassle. Both were out of warranty. Phone side, I had an OG iPhone SE and decided to get the battery replaced right towards the end of the free replacement period. The first/only appointment I could find was at the Emeryville store so I dropped the phone off. Unfortunately they had a runaway thermal event so the store got evacuated. I was told to come back later and pick up my phone. Eff that, I'm not sitting in traffic and paying for bridge toll for their mistake. It took a bit of persuasion, escalation, and a minor tantrum but they did FedEx my phone back to me. Eventually I dropped that and broke the screen. They couldn't fix it and they no longer sold the 64 GB version so I got a new 128 GB one off the shelf for the price of the repair ($130) without even asking. Or 32/64. Whatever. So, yeah, Apple's been good to me with hardware stuff (with and without AppleCare). Clearly they're not making everyone whole. The problem as I see it is that Apple is relying almost entirely on the discretion of their retail staff instead of having a formal policy in place.
- smogcutter 4y ago
  >The problem as I see it is that Apple is relying almost entirely on the discretion of their retail staff instead of having a formal policy in place. So, I worked behind the genius Bar about a decade ago, and can tell you that at least as of then (say iPhone 3g through 6 era) this was definitely not the case. There’s a policy for everything. The issue is that you’re an individual, dealing with another individual who is acting as the intermediary between you and an extraordinarily large and complex logistics and record-keeping system. If you left feeling taken care of and treated fairly, from apple’s POV that’s a successful interaction. But the procedure for getting there may deliberately not be customer-facing; that doesn’t mean the procedure doesn’t exist. I can answer questions if people are interested, with the caveat that my info is (thankfully) not fresh.
  - 4y ago
vineyardmike 4y ago
Who knows if it’s true but apple has publicly stated they lose money on repairs. https://www.engadget.com/2019-11-21-apple-repair-costs.html https://www.engadget.com/2019-11-21-apple-repair-costs.html
- antioppressor 4y ago
  Well, repair is included in the hefty price tag. Anything else about this is just noise.
  - NoPicklez 4y ago
    You've got really no way of knowing that for sure. Could just be a hefty price tag that doesn't include repairs.
  - RedShift1 4y ago
    I don't know why you're being downvoted, manufacturers include warranty costs in their cost bills to determine final sale price.
- Schroedingersat 4y ago
  'We lose money on replacing the entire motherboard for 3 cents under cost whenever any minor thing goes wrong but make bank on refurbished computers with a single resistor that had gone bad which we get for free for some reason'
thathndude 4y ago
The fact is, Apple is generally one of the best support experiences you’re going to have today. But there are also 1,000,000,000+ iOS devices out there, millions of laptops, and a lot of customers. You’re going to have plenty of bad experiences at that scale
- bjoli 4y ago
  What? I have always said "you never leave an apple support experience with a smile. It is always with a belly ache or relief". They are, at least in my part of the world, considered just above Italian car rentals.
  - 9935c101ab17a66 4y ago
    Where do you live? Do you deal with apple support directly, or apple authorized service providers?
    - bjoli 4y ago
      Sweden. I have tried both. The best support i got was when the guy at the authorized service provider told me to take the business across the street since it was both faster and cheaper and the device was out of warranty anyway.
talal7860 4y ago
I got a new MacBook Pro 2 years ago whose screen got black lines after a few days of use, went to Apple support, they changed the screen and didn’t charge me a cent. The guy told me since there’s no physical damage, nothing would be charged
spike021 4y ago
Eh. About 10 years ago I had one of the older white iMacs, I think like a 2008 model or thereabouts. After owning it around 5 years and no longer being under warranty, it had some motherboard problem I brought it in for anyway. The Apple Store Geniuses (?) tried fixing it a couple different ways but couldn't, so they replaced it with a similarly-specced current (at the time) model for free.
robflynn 4y ago
I had a Macbook pro gpu go bad a couple years outside the warranty of the laptop. They replaced the entire thing for me and also noticed a little dent in the case and swapped that out too, I essentially got a new (old) machine handed to me with my hard drive swapped to it. They didn't charge me anything for that either. I realize this is just anecdotal, though.

Both of your examples are software related. In my experience, anything hardware related Apple tends to shift the blame to the consumer. I wonder how much of their profits are based on repairs.

Handytinge 4y ago

It's also worth noting he's in Australia, where sane consumer laws exist that Apple have to operate in. The staff here are pretty good.

rootusrootus 4y ago

I think it's perhaps more random than that. Friend of mine had a problem with an older MBP. He took it in to get repaired, it was going to be a system board replacement, but since they didn't have that part handy they just sent him out with a brand new MBP with comparable (but slightly better) specs than his original. For all the people complaining about Apple, they haven't screwed me over yet either, I've only had good experiences. All hardware, I haven't had a software issue I couldn't find the fix for on my own.

Bilal_io 4y ago
I assume your friend had Apple Care, in which case it would be expected to receive a replacement device if they cannot repair it or cannot repair it in a timely manner.
- rootusrootus 4y ago
  He did, but it was out of AppleCare too. The kicker was that the problem had begun to manifest while still within the three year window, so there was documented history. It was most of a year out of AppleCare when it failed the last time and they decided to cover it as goodwill.

pier25 4y ago

In my experience when there are design flaws Apple won't move a finger until there are class action lawsuits. And good luck if you're outside the US. Not sure how it is in other countries, but in Mexico Apple doesn't do repairs. It's all left to authorized third parties that really will only try to get as much money from you as possible or get you to buy a new device. I know a couple of people that were denied repairs/replacements on the infamous butterfly keyboards because these repair centers said they couldn't reproduce the issue themselves. Most likely they didn't want to do the repairs because their margin was too low.

inferiorhuman 4y ago

Anyone who's read my comments knows I don't usually have the patience to be charming or whatever. I had a battery start bulging with a polycarbonate MacBook and they just gave me a battery off the shelf no questions asked. There was some other underlying problem, and I eventually scrapped it. Its replacement eventually heated up the charging cable enough that the insulation browned and flaked away (computer side so it's not replaceable). I got a free replacement with zero hassle. Both were out of warranty. Phone side, I had an OG iPhone SE and decided to get the battery replaced right towards the end of the free replacement period. The first/only appointment I could find was at the Emeryville store so I dropped the phone off. Unfortunately they had a runaway thermal event so the store got evacuated. I was told to come back later and pick up my phone. Eff that, I'm not sitting in traffic and paying for bridge toll for their mistake. It took a bit of persuasion, escalation, and a minor tantrum but they did FedEx my phone back to me. Eventually I dropped that and broke the screen. They couldn't fix it and they no longer sold the 64 GB version so I got a new 128 GB one off the shelf for the price of the repair ($130) without even asking. Or 32/64. Whatever. So, yeah, Apple's been good to me with hardware stuff (with and without AppleCare). Clearly they're not making everyone whole. The problem as I see it is that Apple is relying almost entirely on the discretion of their retail staff instead of having a formal policy in place.

smogcutter 4y ago
>The problem as I see it is that Apple is relying almost entirely on the discretion of their retail staff instead of having a formal policy in place. So, I worked behind the genius Bar about a decade ago, and can tell you that at least as of then (say iPhone 3g through 6 era) this was definitely not the case. There’s a policy for everything. The issue is that you’re an individual, dealing with another individual who is acting as the intermediary between you and an extraordinarily large and complex logistics and record-keeping system. If you left feeling taken care of and treated fairly, from apple’s POV that’s a successful interaction. But the procedure for getting there may deliberately not be customer-facing; that doesn’t mean the procedure doesn’t exist. I can answer questions if people are interested, with the caveat that my info is (thankfully) not fresh.
- 4y ago

vineyardmike 4y ago

Who knows if it’s true but apple has publicly stated they lose money on repairs. https://www.engadget.com/2019-11-21-apple-repair-costs.html https://www.engadget.com/2019-11-21-apple-repair-costs.html

antioppressor 4y ago
Well, repair is included in the hefty price tag. Anything else about this is just noise.
- NoPicklez 4y ago
  You've got really no way of knowing that for sure. Could just be a hefty price tag that doesn't include repairs.
- RedShift1 4y ago
  I don't know why you're being downvoted, manufacturers include warranty costs in their cost bills to determine final sale price.
Schroedingersat 4y ago
'We lose money on replacing the entire motherboard for 3 cents under cost whenever any minor thing goes wrong but make bank on refurbished computers with a single resistor that had gone bad which we get for free for some reason'

thathndude 4y ago

The fact is, Apple is generally one of the best support experiences you’re going to have today. But there are also 1,000,000,000+ iOS devices out there, millions of laptops, and a lot of customers. You’re going to have plenty of bad experiences at that scale

bjoli 4y ago
What? I have always said "you never leave an apple support experience with a smile. It is always with a belly ache or relief". They are, at least in my part of the world, considered just above Italian car rentals.
- 9935c101ab17a66 4y ago
  Where do you live? Do you deal with apple support directly, or apple authorized service providers?
  - bjoli 4y ago
    Sweden. I have tried both. The best support i got was when the guy at the authorized service provider told me to take the business across the street since it was both faster and cheaper and the device was out of warranty anyway.

talal7860 4y ago

I got a new MacBook Pro 2 years ago whose screen got black lines after a few days of use, went to Apple support, they changed the screen and didn’t charge me a cent. The guy told me since there’s no physical damage, nothing would be charged

spike021 4y ago

Eh. About 10 years ago I had one of the older white iMacs, I think like a 2008 model or thereabouts. After owning it around 5 years and no longer being under warranty, it had some motherboard problem I brought it in for anyway. The Apple Store Geniuses (?) tried fixing it a couple different ways but couldn't, so they replaced it with a similarly-specced current (at the time) model for free.

robflynn 4y ago

I had a Macbook pro gpu go bad a couple years outside the warranty of the laptop. They replaced the entire thing for me and also noticed a little dent in the case and swapped that out too, I essentially got a new (old) machine handed to me with my hard drive swapped to it. They didn't charge me anything for that either. I realize this is just anecdotal, though.