5 ms·

I feel as though a lot of the consumer value of x86+Windows comes from its wide library of software and compatibility. > than is obvious to us on HN I think y

I feel as though a lot of the consumer value of x86+Windows comes from its wide library of software and compatibility. > than is obvious to us on HN I think your average HNer is more likely to interact with Linux/Mac workstations or servers, where binary compatibility isn't as necessary.

Dalewyn 4y ago
This. There is a reason Win32 foiled every single attempt from Microsoft to kill it, and a reason Intel has consistently failed to successfully market anything besides x86 processors. The reason is the PC world at large is a mountain of x86 and Win32 code piled sky high by decades of developers and users. Replacing all that takes money and time that nobody wants to spend, and chances are the replacement won't be a 1:1 drop-in replacement either which will necessitate further money and time nobody wants to spend. The average computer enthusiast might scoff at being able to run half-a-century old x86/Win32 code and binaries on modern hardware. Professionals consider that backwards compatibility their literal lifeblood and will pay handsomely to ensure nobody violates it (and refuse to pay anyone who does). I expect the ARM world will also be singing a similar tune in several decades' time, when backwards compatibility with ancient ARM binaries become steadily more important than pursuing the next new shiny at any cost.
- anyfoo 4y ago
  Things change. Windows cut out 16-bit code with 64-bit Windows, so that particular half of the last "half century" is gone. Macs transitionedto different architectures several times, iPhones to some extend too (from armv7 to armv8, dropping arm32 support entirely relatively early after). The various Rosettas, most recently the x86-to-ARM one, showed that software emulation is always an option, and so does WoW64, which is a part of ARM Windows (and a part of x86-64 Windows, but there it's not really a software emulator). > I expect the ARM world will also be singing a similar tune in several decades' time, when backwards compatibility with ancient ARM binaries become steadily more important than pursuing the next new shiny at any cost. I am not so sure at all about that. The reason is that half to a quarter decade ago, even normal application code was very close to the metal, with MS-DOS basically being a glorified bootloader with file system services that loaded little mini-OSes calling themselves DOS applications. We are far, far away from that world. Mature abstractions make ISA transitions more and more painless for end-user application developers. The exponential advances in speed make software emulation well feasible for the remainder. High-performance stuff will want to take advantage of the new architectures anyway.
  - pjmlp 4y ago
    Now make that emulation work at feasible speed on a 300 euro laptop, bought in random shopping mall.
    - anyfoo 4y ago
      I don’t have hard data, but doesn’t seem unrealistic to me. Computers are really unbelievably much faster then they used to be.
  - anyfoo 4y ago
    > The reason is that half to a quarter decade ago Half to a quarter century, I mistyped here. Half to a quarter decade ago we were long since there already.

Dalewyn 4y ago

This. There is a reason Win32 foiled every single attempt from Microsoft to kill it, and a reason Intel has consistently failed to successfully market anything besides x86 processors. The reason is the PC world at large is a mountain of x86 and Win32 code piled sky high by decades of developers and users. Replacing all that takes money and time that nobody wants to spend, and chances are the replacement won't be a 1:1 drop-in replacement either which will necessitate further money and time nobody wants to spend. The average computer enthusiast might scoff at being able to run half-a-century old x86/Win32 code and binaries on modern hardware. Professionals consider that backwards compatibility their literal lifeblood and will pay handsomely to ensure nobody violates it (and refuse to pay anyone who does). I expect the ARM world will also be singing a similar tune in several decades' time, when backwards compatibility with ancient ARM binaries become steadily more important than pursuing the next new shiny at any cost.

anyfoo 4y ago
Things change. Windows cut out 16-bit code with 64-bit Windows, so that particular half of the last "half century" is gone. Macs transitionedto different architectures several times, iPhones to some extend too (from armv7 to armv8, dropping arm32 support entirely relatively early after). The various Rosettas, most recently the x86-to-ARM one, showed that software emulation is always an option, and so does WoW64, which is a part of ARM Windows (and a part of x86-64 Windows, but there it's not really a software emulator). > I expect the ARM world will also be singing a similar tune in several decades' time, when backwards compatibility with ancient ARM binaries become steadily more important than pursuing the next new shiny at any cost. I am not so sure at all about that. The reason is that half to a quarter decade ago, even normal application code was very close to the metal, with MS-DOS basically being a glorified bootloader with file system services that loaded little mini-OSes calling themselves DOS applications. We are far, far away from that world. Mature abstractions make ISA transitions more and more painless for end-user application developers. The exponential advances in speed make software emulation well feasible for the remainder. High-performance stuff will want to take advantage of the new architectures anyway.
- pjmlp 4y ago
  Now make that emulation work at feasible speed on a 300 euro laptop, bought in random shopping mall.
  - anyfoo 4y ago
    I don’t have hard data, but doesn’t seem unrealistic to me. Computers are really unbelievably much faster then they used to be.
- anyfoo 4y ago
  > The reason is that half to a quarter decade ago Half to a quarter century, I mistyped here. Half to a quarter decade ago we were long since there already.