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So, you are suggesting that the Bluetooth SIG did just a fine job with the technology, no problems there, and that people like Apple don't see fit to use the mo

by natch 4y ago

So, you are suggesting that the Bluetooth SIG did just a fine job with the technology, no problems there, and that people like Apple don't see fit to use the money in their budget to cough up a membership fee? Seeing as how it is Apple devices on which I often encounter pairing difficulties. Super convenient for the SIG that they can point fingers like this (I wonder if that's why they set it up as you describe, ugh), but I would be skeptical of any implication that Apple doesn't pay a membership fee.

wvenable 4y ago
Are you sure the problem is Apple and not the device on the other side?
- natch 4y ago
  Both sides are Apple, fully updated, expert user, in close proximity, good charge, blah blah blah. Maybe it’s me… or… just maybe… Bluetooth does have room for improvement.
  - ricardobeat 4y ago
    In my experience the W1-equipped headphones all work flawlessly, pairing is instant. The only thing that is still annoying is the difficulty of managing multiple devices & headphones, when the built-in 'right thing to do' (like connecting to the last used device) can conflict with your real intent.
xlii 4y ago
AFAIK it's not about Apple, but about other producers either polluting spectrum or plainly ignoring specs. There was a post about Logitech not creating a lot of interference with their MX products (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31939424 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31939424). Interestingly enough getting rid of Logitech devices fixed most of the BT issues I had.
- natch 4y ago
  That’s a good point and something I could look into (very) locally in my setup. Not many non-Apple devices around except a couple of cars and one mouse but yeah they could be causing problems.
- googlryas 4y ago
  I have constant issues the single bluetooth device in myhouse - my Bose bluetooth QC-35s, and a google produced phone and google produced laptop which it connects to. Both of those groups should be able to get bluetooth right.
  - solardev 4y ago
    I can't even get my Airpods to work consistently with my iPad, or Pixel Buds to work consistently with my Pixel phone. And it gets exponentially worse if you try to connect to more than one device at a time, across vendors or even chipsets. Bluetooth is a hopeless mess.
bee_rider 4y ago
Do you have other non-Apple devices with which you encounter pairing difficulties? My experience with Bluetooth headphones was that on an iPhone they were occasionally annoying, while on Linux they were quite poor and on Windows they were more like a practical joke. This would have been like 4-5 years ago though, maybe all the stacks have been improved.
- JLCarveth 4y ago
  Honestly my linux desktop (Ubuntu 22.04) is where I run into the fewest issues regarding my bluetooth headphones. I've never had an issue connecting to them.
  - bee_rider 4y ago
    Hmm. The issues that come to mind are annoying pairing (Arch -- probably my fault, too manual) and some weird random disconnects on Ubuntu, but that might be some power-saving issue specific to my chip. So maybe I just got unlucky random outcomes.
  - ikeboy 4y ago
    I've had issues where every other time I connect my Sony XM5 to Ubuntu 22.04, it decides to use HFP instead of A2DP which has significantly worse audio quality for music. I need to reset Bluetooth to fix it. None of the solutions online for disabling this "helpful" feature work.
    - solardev 4y ago
      Heh, that was the same issue that made me give up on desktop Linux (though with the XM3) and go back to Windows/Mac... three years ago. It's just never going to get priority because it doesn't have the marketshare. Sony doesn't care about Linux and Canonical doesn't care about Sony. If I were you, I'd consider an external bluetooth adapter that supports A2DP and connects to the 3.5mm plug on your computer, like this one: https://aluratek.com/universal-bluetooth-optical-audio-receiver-and-transmitter-with-bluetooth-five https://aluratek.com/universal-bluetooth-optical-audio-recei... Look for AptX low-latency support too if you care about audio lag (for movies or games).
antomeie 4y ago
SIG did not do an excellent job with the tech, that's for sure, but his point is still valid, that poor implementations of it causes further issues. Also, SIG is quite slow with new features, so companies start adding their own stuff on top of it. With Apple, things like sharing BT pairings over iCloud comes to mind, which is kind of a weird hack. They also do some non-standard switching between LE and Classic on the go.

by natch 4y ago

wvenable 4y ago

Are you sure the problem is Apple and not the device on the other side?

natch 4y ago
Both sides are Apple, fully updated, expert user, in close proximity, good charge, blah blah blah. Maybe it’s me… or… just maybe… Bluetooth does have room for improvement.
- ricardobeat 4y ago
  In my experience the W1-equipped headphones all work flawlessly, pairing is instant. The only thing that is still annoying is the difficulty of managing multiple devices & headphones, when the built-in 'right thing to do' (like connecting to the last used device) can conflict with your real intent.

xlii 4y ago

AFAIK it's not about Apple, but about other producers either polluting spectrum or plainly ignoring specs. There was a post about Logitech not creating a lot of interference with their MX products (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31939424 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31939424). Interestingly enough getting rid of Logitech devices fixed most of the BT issues I had.

natch 4y ago
That’s a good point and something I could look into (very) locally in my setup. Not many non-Apple devices around except a couple of cars and one mouse but yeah they could be causing problems.
googlryas 4y ago
I have constant issues the single bluetooth device in myhouse - my Bose bluetooth QC-35s, and a google produced phone and google produced laptop which it connects to. Both of those groups should be able to get bluetooth right.
- solardev 4y ago
  I can't even get my Airpods to work consistently with my iPad, or Pixel Buds to work consistently with my Pixel phone. And it gets exponentially worse if you try to connect to more than one device at a time, across vendors or even chipsets. Bluetooth is a hopeless mess.

bee_rider 4y ago

Do you have other non-Apple devices with which you encounter pairing difficulties? My experience with Bluetooth headphones was that on an iPhone they were occasionally annoying, while on Linux they were quite poor and on Windows they were more like a practical joke. This would have been like 4-5 years ago though, maybe all the stacks have been improved.

JLCarveth 4y ago
Honestly my linux desktop (Ubuntu 22.04) is where I run into the fewest issues regarding my bluetooth headphones. I've never had an issue connecting to them.
- bee_rider 4y ago
  Hmm. The issues that come to mind are annoying pairing (Arch -- probably my fault, too manual) and some weird random disconnects on Ubuntu, but that might be some power-saving issue specific to my chip. So maybe I just got unlucky random outcomes.
- ikeboy 4y ago
  I've had issues where every other time I connect my Sony XM5 to Ubuntu 22.04, it decides to use HFP instead of A2DP which has significantly worse audio quality for music. I need to reset Bluetooth to fix it. None of the solutions online for disabling this "helpful" feature work.
  - solardev 4y ago
    Heh, that was the same issue that made me give up on desktop Linux (though with the XM3) and go back to Windows/Mac... three years ago. It's just never going to get priority because it doesn't have the marketshare. Sony doesn't care about Linux and Canonical doesn't care about Sony. If I were you, I'd consider an external bluetooth adapter that supports A2DP and connects to the 3.5mm plug on your computer, like this one: https://aluratek.com/universal-bluetooth-optical-audio-receiver-and-transmitter-with-bluetooth-five https://aluratek.com/universal-bluetooth-optical-audio-recei... Look for AptX low-latency support too if you care about audio lag (for movies or games).

antomeie 4y ago

SIG did not do an excellent job with the tech, that's for sure, but his point is still valid, that poor implementations of it causes further issues. Also, SIG is quite slow with new features, so companies start adding their own stuff on top of it. With Apple, things like sharing BT pairings over iCloud comes to mind, which is kind of a weird hack. They also do some non-standard switching between LE and Classic on the go.