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Private bounty hunter businesses are harmful to society.

pc86 4y ago
If they are, then they should be illegal. If they are illegal, and this qualifies, then this guy should be punished. None of this negates anything I said previously.
- UncleMeat 4y ago
  Our society is not perfect. A large number of antisocial things are legal. It is completely reasonable to criticize somebody for doing a thing that is both legal and also antisocial. I feel for this guy. He is getting screwed by a high-violence region. But his approach to solving this problem makes the world worse, not better.
  - pc86 4y ago
    I think it's important to keep the specifics in mind as these things live and die on the specific details. A criminal came to his private property and attempted to steal. He was able to keep the person there - for less than ten minutes - until that person was arrested. Presumably that person is in jail now or at least on probation. Please explain how just letting this person steal leaves the world better than having him get punished for his actions. When victims of crime shrug their shoulders and just say "aw shucks" it incentivizes more crime, which makes the world objectively worse.
    - UncleMeat 4y ago
      I'm not talking about him protecting his property. I'm talking about the bensforbars thing. Paying people to track down specific criminals is very different than protecting ones property in the moment.
      - LudwigNagasena 4y ago
        > Paying people to track down specific criminals is very different than protecting ones property in the moment. What is the alternative? Paying people to track down criminals is how law enforcement works almost everywhere.
        UncleMeat 4y ago
        There is a major difference between a state organization with shared ownership and management through democratic processes and private business. The police have enough problems as an institution. Private vigilantes are going to be worse.
        LudwigNagasena 4y ago
        There is a major difference between an organization with shared ownership and management through democratic processes and an institution several decision-makers removed from that. It is not clear that private investigators without privileges of monopoly on violence should be worse.
- ahoy 4y ago
  It's not illegal, therefore it's not a bad thing. And since it's not a bad thing, its not illegal. did i get that right
12many 4y ago
People who rob businesses are harmful to society. Fixed that for you.
- UncleMeat 4y ago
  It is also true that people who rob businesses are harmful to society. That is completely independent of the terrible outcomes caused by private vigilanteism.
  - hunterb123 4y ago
    vigilanteism implies he hunted him down. the trespasser came to his property. the guy confronted him and held him there until the authorities arrived. are you implying people should not protect their livelihood and let trespassers loot even if they could stop them? why should those property owners who are fully in the right morally and legally do that when the trespassers are flagrantly breaking the law?
    - UncleMeat 4y ago
      I'm not talking about him protecting his property. I'm talking about the bensforbars thing.
      - hunterb123 4y ago
        I see, but I don't find a problem with that either though. Seems no different than crime stoppers, it's usually just a reward for information leading to an arrest, it's not an actual bounty. It's not excluding that, but he's most likely hoping someone who knows the person who stole it will rat for the money. And I think you'll have to provide examples of the "terrible outcomes caused by private vigilanteism".
        iluvcommunism 4y ago
        This is why I stopped commenting here. HN commenters have schizophrenia it seems like.
djbebs 4y ago
On the contrary, their lack is what's harmful to society.

pc86 4y ago

If they are, then they should be illegal. If they are illegal, and this qualifies, then this guy should be punished. None of this negates anything I said previously.

UncleMeat 4y ago
Our society is not perfect. A large number of antisocial things are legal. It is completely reasonable to criticize somebody for doing a thing that is both legal and also antisocial. I feel for this guy. He is getting screwed by a high-violence region. But his approach to solving this problem makes the world worse, not better.
- pc86 4y ago
  I think it's important to keep the specifics in mind as these things live and die on the specific details. A criminal came to his private property and attempted to steal. He was able to keep the person there - for less than ten minutes - until that person was arrested. Presumably that person is in jail now or at least on probation. Please explain how just letting this person steal leaves the world better than having him get punished for his actions. When victims of crime shrug their shoulders and just say "aw shucks" it incentivizes more crime, which makes the world objectively worse.
  - UncleMeat 4y ago
    I'm not talking about him protecting his property. I'm talking about the bensforbars thing. Paying people to track down specific criminals is very different than protecting ones property in the moment.
    - LudwigNagasena 4y ago
      > Paying people to track down specific criminals is very different than protecting ones property in the moment. What is the alternative? Paying people to track down criminals is how law enforcement works almost everywhere.
      - UncleMeat 4y ago
        There is a major difference between a state organization with shared ownership and management through democratic processes and private business. The police have enough problems as an institution. Private vigilantes are going to be worse.
        LudwigNagasena 4y ago
        There is a major difference between an organization with shared ownership and management through democratic processes and an institution several decision-makers removed from that. It is not clear that private investigators without privileges of monopoly on violence should be worse.
ahoy 4y ago
It's not illegal, therefore it's not a bad thing. And since it's not a bad thing, its not illegal. did i get that right

12many 4y ago

People who rob businesses are harmful to society. Fixed that for you.

UncleMeat 4y ago
It is also true that people who rob businesses are harmful to society. That is completely independent of the terrible outcomes caused by private vigilanteism.
- hunterb123 4y ago
  vigilanteism implies he hunted him down. the trespasser came to his property. the guy confronted him and held him there until the authorities arrived. are you implying people should not protect their livelihood and let trespassers loot even if they could stop them? why should those property owners who are fully in the right morally and legally do that when the trespassers are flagrantly breaking the law?
  - UncleMeat 4y ago
    I'm not talking about him protecting his property. I'm talking about the bensforbars thing.
    - hunterb123 4y ago
      I see, but I don't find a problem with that either though. Seems no different than crime stoppers, it's usually just a reward for information leading to an arrest, it's not an actual bounty. It's not excluding that, but he's most likely hoping someone who knows the person who stole it will rat for the money. And I think you'll have to provide examples of the "terrible outcomes caused by private vigilanteism".
      - iluvcommunism 4y ago
        This is why I stopped commenting here. HN commenters have schizophrenia it seems like.

djbebs 4y ago

On the contrary, their lack is what's harmful to society.