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All of that hardware in a wooden box scares me. I'd recommend keeping all that in a metal enclosure in a utility room where the hardware can catch fire without

All of that hardware in a wooden box scares me. I'd recommend keeping all that in a metal enclosure in a utility room where the hardware can catch fire without setting the entire house ablaze.

giuliomagnifico 4y ago
Ahah yes correct, I’m a bit scared too. This is why I have put inside the cabine a SwitchBot connected thermostat and I have a Homebridge plug-in that sends me various alerts via push notifications (using Pushover app) when the temperature inside the cabinet goes above “28-32-36-it’s_on_fire ºC”. And it works, see alerts screenshot: https://i.imgur.com/BvEesUD.png https://i.imgur.com/BvEesUD.png I’ve explained my setup at the beginning of the post, there’s also the “temperatures alerts” in my previous blog post. Also if the temperature raise too much, the A/C above the wooden cabinet turns on and cools down all the hardware. During the night thishappened various times during this hot summer! > I'd recommend keeping all that in a metal enclosure in a utility room where the hardware can catch fire without setting the entire house ablaze Yes but you cannot agree with me that the metal racks are terrible/ugly =] I want to have my network things inside my house, possibly where I can see them, and I don’t want to have a metal rack inside my living room, see my first post with all the house rooms (http://giuliomagnifico.blog/networking/2022/01/14/my-home-setup.html http://giuliomagnifico.blog/networking/2022/01/14/my-home-se...). Anyway I can’t say that the fire risk is concrete, as always with electrical things. But I prefer to monitor this risk with sensors and maintenance instead of “move the risk in the garage/car park or cellar” (I also have a fire extinguisher hidden inside a wardrobe, just in case…)
- vladvasiliu 4y ago
  Alerts and a fire extinguisher are great, but what can you do about them if they trigger while you're away? The A/C starting if things get too hot is great, especially if it doesn't depend on any of said things not being out of order (say because it shut down because of the heat).
  - giuliomagnifico 4y ago
    I can turn off the devices remotely if something gets too hot (via WireGuard), but I’ve never done it for the temperature. But in my house, like every house, there’s a fridge, a boiler, the A/Cs, burners with gas, etc… everything could get on fire. I can also call my parents or neighbors to ask if they are seeing smoke out of my house =] that’s the most efficient alarm!
    - Nextgrid 4y ago
      > there’s a fridge, a boiler, the A/Cs, burners with gas, etc… everything could get on fire. Most of these appliances don't actually have flammable materials right next to the active components that can catch fire. A circuit board can catch fire but it'll likely self-extinguish because it's in a metal enclosure away from anything flammable.
      - giuliomagnifico 4y ago
        My house is all made of wood: http://giuliomagnifico.blog/networking/2022/01/14/my-home-setup.html http://giuliomagnifico.blog/networking/2022/01/14/my-home-se...
- Nextgrid 4y ago
  I wouldn't be worried about overheating - most hardware will shut down for safety way before you reach temperatures capable of igniting a fire. Instead I'm worried about catastrophic failure (especially of power-related components such as PSUs or that UPS) where the thing explodes out of the blue and spits out sparks and flames. In this case, you'll very quickly get a self-sustaining fire (thanks to all that firewood around it) and will need to actively extinguish it - turning the power off or starting the AC will not save you. The best solution, short of an active fire suppression system such as sprinklers (which obviously come with their own problems) is to put the hardware in a place where you can have a device catch fire and be confident that the fire won't spread or get out of hand.
  - giuliomagnifico 4y ago
    The floor, like the ceiling, are made of wood, I have other UPS on the floor, also my desk with the notebook is made of wood… http://giuliomagnifico.blog/networking/2022/01/14/my-home-setup.html http://giuliomagnifico.blog/networking/2022/01/14/my-home-se... I understand what you say, unfortunately! I hope that nothing will ever happen…
- 57FkMytWjyFu 4y ago
  The AC is probably not going to turn on if the UPS is discharging.
57FkMytWjyFu 4y ago
I was thinking you were too worried, and then I went back and saw the UPS. I wouldn't put that inside any enclosure. From the manual "• Provide 5 cm clearance on top and sides for adequate airflow around the unit."
- giuliomagnifico 4y ago
  The UPS is not even lukewarm. I was scared too, first time I put UPS in another position (see other posts/releases of the setup) with more space but then, after one year of monitoring, I always see that its temperature is the lowest of all the hardware inside, I moved it there (anyway I can move it 5cm from the left side, there’s plenty of space). I have others UPS (another range of APC UPS) that are getting a bit warm, but not this one.
  - exitb 4y ago
    I imagine its temperature habits might be different in case it becomes active with a power loss or when it recharges after an incident.
criddell 4y ago
Is it much different from putting a bunch of A/V gear in a wooden cabinet? It's not that uncommon for a receiver, game console, cable box, blue ray player, etc... to be in wood furniture.
- vladvasiliu 4y ago
  The main difference I see is that, at least in my case, the A/V gear will be off when I'm not actively using it, i.e., sitting in front of it. My network gear runs 24/7, even if I'm away from home for multiple days at a time. I usually only turn it off when I leave for longer (>1 week) holidays.
  - VLM 4y ago
    If it has a working remote control or a soft start power switch its never "off". Most cheap hardware does not have X or Y safety class capacitors so if there's any exposed conductor you're probably marginally safer on an insulator like wood.
    - Nextgrid 4y ago
      I'd expect most components to fail under stress which is not the case in a low-power standby mode where only a single 5V power rail is active and sources a few milliamps. Not great and I personally wouldn't put equipment in cabinets, but I'd expect most failures to occur when the equipment is actively being used & under stress, not during standby.
      - VLM 4y ago
        There is a self heating failure mode for capacitors that would depend a little bit on current drawn, but the voltage across a cap would be constant regardless of current drawn so safety and fire related failures are primary based on time. "Name Brand" products with legitimate UL listings almost entirely use Class X or Y caps where safety regulations require them and would be immune to this problem due to internal construction differences. "No name gray market off aliexpress" would be an unwise choice. It's surprising how few fires we have from household electronics. The odds are it'll be fine.

All of that hardware in a wooden box scares me. I'd recommend keeping all that in a metal enclosure in a utility room where the hardware can catch fire without setting the entire house ablaze.

giuliomagnifico 4y ago

Ahah yes correct, I’m a bit scared too. This is why I have put inside the cabine a SwitchBot connected thermostat and I have a Homebridge plug-in that sends me various alerts via push notifications (using Pushover app) when the temperature inside the cabinet goes above “28-32-36-it’s_on_fire ºC”. And it works, see alerts screenshot: https://i.imgur.com/BvEesUD.png https://i.imgur.com/BvEesUD.png I’ve explained my setup at the beginning of the post, there’s also the “temperatures alerts” in my previous blog post. Also if the temperature raise too much, the A/C above the wooden cabinet turns on and cools down all the hardware. During the night thishappened various times during this hot summer! > I'd recommend keeping all that in a metal enclosure in a utility room where the hardware can catch fire without setting the entire house ablaze Yes but you cannot agree with me that the metal racks are terrible/ugly =] I want to have my network things inside my house, possibly where I can see them, and I don’t want to have a metal rack inside my living room, see my first post with all the house rooms (http://giuliomagnifico.blog/networking/2022/01/14/my-home-setup.html http://giuliomagnifico.blog/networking/2022/01/14/my-home-se...). Anyway I can’t say that the fire risk is concrete, as always with electrical things. But I prefer to monitor this risk with sensors and maintenance instead of “move the risk in the garage/car park or cellar” (I also have a fire extinguisher hidden inside a wardrobe, just in case…)

vladvasiliu 4y ago
Alerts and a fire extinguisher are great, but what can you do about them if they trigger while you're away? The A/C starting if things get too hot is great, especially if it doesn't depend on any of said things not being out of order (say because it shut down because of the heat).
- giuliomagnifico 4y ago
  I can turn off the devices remotely if something gets too hot (via WireGuard), but I’ve never done it for the temperature. But in my house, like every house, there’s a fridge, a boiler, the A/Cs, burners with gas, etc… everything could get on fire. I can also call my parents or neighbors to ask if they are seeing smoke out of my house =] that’s the most efficient alarm!
  - Nextgrid 4y ago
    > there’s a fridge, a boiler, the A/Cs, burners with gas, etc… everything could get on fire. Most of these appliances don't actually have flammable materials right next to the active components that can catch fire. A circuit board can catch fire but it'll likely self-extinguish because it's in a metal enclosure away from anything flammable.
    - giuliomagnifico 4y ago
      My house is all made of wood: http://giuliomagnifico.blog/networking/2022/01/14/my-home-setup.html http://giuliomagnifico.blog/networking/2022/01/14/my-home-se...
Nextgrid 4y ago
I wouldn't be worried about overheating - most hardware will shut down for safety way before you reach temperatures capable of igniting a fire. Instead I'm worried about catastrophic failure (especially of power-related components such as PSUs or that UPS) where the thing explodes out of the blue and spits out sparks and flames. In this case, you'll very quickly get a self-sustaining fire (thanks to all that firewood around it) and will need to actively extinguish it - turning the power off or starting the AC will not save you. The best solution, short of an active fire suppression system such as sprinklers (which obviously come with their own problems) is to put the hardware in a place where you can have a device catch fire and be confident that the fire won't spread or get out of hand.
- giuliomagnifico 4y ago
  The floor, like the ceiling, are made of wood, I have other UPS on the floor, also my desk with the notebook is made of wood… http://giuliomagnifico.blog/networking/2022/01/14/my-home-setup.html http://giuliomagnifico.blog/networking/2022/01/14/my-home-se... I understand what you say, unfortunately! I hope that nothing will ever happen…
57FkMytWjyFu 4y ago
The AC is probably not going to turn on if the UPS is discharging.

57FkMytWjyFu 4y ago

I was thinking you were too worried, and then I went back and saw the UPS. I wouldn't put that inside any enclosure. From the manual "• Provide 5 cm clearance on top and sides for adequate airflow around the unit."

giuliomagnifico 4y ago
The UPS is not even lukewarm. I was scared too, first time I put UPS in another position (see other posts/releases of the setup) with more space but then, after one year of monitoring, I always see that its temperature is the lowest of all the hardware inside, I moved it there (anyway I can move it 5cm from the left side, there’s plenty of space). I have others UPS (another range of APC UPS) that are getting a bit warm, but not this one.
- exitb 4y ago
  I imagine its temperature habits might be different in case it becomes active with a power loss or when it recharges after an incident.

criddell 4y ago

Is it much different from putting a bunch of A/V gear in a wooden cabinet? It's not that uncommon for a receiver, game console, cable box, blue ray player, etc... to be in wood furniture.

vladvasiliu 4y ago
The main difference I see is that, at least in my case, the A/V gear will be off when I'm not actively using it, i.e., sitting in front of it. My network gear runs 24/7, even if I'm away from home for multiple days at a time. I usually only turn it off when I leave for longer (>1 week) holidays.
- VLM 4y ago
  If it has a working remote control or a soft start power switch its never "off". Most cheap hardware does not have X or Y safety class capacitors so if there's any exposed conductor you're probably marginally safer on an insulator like wood.
  - Nextgrid 4y ago
    I'd expect most components to fail under stress which is not the case in a low-power standby mode where only a single 5V power rail is active and sources a few milliamps. Not great and I personally wouldn't put equipment in cabinets, but I'd expect most failures to occur when the equipment is actively being used & under stress, not during standby.
    - VLM 4y ago
      There is a self heating failure mode for capacitors that would depend a little bit on current drawn, but the voltage across a cap would be constant regardless of current drawn so safety and fire related failures are primary based on time. "Name Brand" products with legitimate UL listings almost entirely use Class X or Y caps where safety regulations require them and would be immune to this problem due to internal construction differences. "No name gray market off aliexpress" would be an unwise choice. It's surprising how few fires we have from household electronics. The odds are it'll be fine.