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I was a sub-consultant on a few projects for Phillip Morris, the tobacco company. The primary consultant was an architect. He ran his own firm and explained tha

by imgabe 4y ago

I was a sub-consultant on a few projects for Phillip Morris, the tobacco company. The primary consultant was an architect. He ran his own firm and explained that where he worked before he went out on his own, PM was a client and they basically kept his old company afloat during the 2008-2009 financial crisis and prevented himself and a lot of his coworkers from being laid off, so he felt some gratitude for that. The headquarters / factory seemed like a really nice place to work, all things considered. There was a great cafeteria with discounted, healthy, fresh food. Everything seemed clean and well organized. Apparently the pay / benefits were good for the area. It also smelled heavenly. (I quit smoking many years ago, but fresh tobacco smells good, not like cigarette smoke.) I think for the most part, businesses exist because they serve a need people have. If they don't, they go out of business. You can rail against fossil fuels, but people still need to drive to work and heat their homes and there aren't other good options that are available yet on a scale that can replace everything. Until there are, we're going to continue having to use fossil fuels, so vilifying the people who provide them doesn't do much good. I do wonder how anyone justified working at Purdue Pharma, though.

jerojero 4y ago
What need does the tobacco industry serve that was not created through addiction and marketing? The oil industry knows about the damage they've been doing to the planet for decades. But not only they ramped up production but also lobbied hard against any form of regulation that might affect their business. The result of this is not that we have a need for it, but dependence. People work to be able to give themselves and their families a good life, everyone wants to be happy. That's it, what other justification is needed? Most of these industries might have been born from a need but their whole goal as they develop is to get society to depend on them so that the need is not covered by better (less impactful) industries.
- imgabe 4y ago
  You could ask the same thing about alcohol, or gambling. But people have been doing these things since before there were industries for them, so there’s apparently something besides marketing that causes humans to want those things. The better way to combat these “evil” industries would be to fulfill that need as well or better in less destructive ways, making the industry obsolete.
sterlind 4y ago
Re: Purdue, that's easy. Painkillers make living with intense chronic pain bearable. Oxycontin was a great pain med for a lot of people. A friend of mine has a mangled spinal cord, and she's severely crippled by the pain alone. But then the opioid crisis happened, they forced doctors to stop prescribing long-term opioids and now her liver's failing from the sheer stress of her writhing in pain constantly. So if I'd worked at Purdue, I'd think of the patients, rather than the junkies, the way you think of the cafeteria rather than lung cancer.

by imgabe 4y ago

jerojero 4y ago

What need does the tobacco industry serve that was not created through addiction and marketing? The oil industry knows about the damage they've been doing to the planet for decades. But not only they ramped up production but also lobbied hard against any form of regulation that might affect their business. The result of this is not that we have a need for it, but dependence. People work to be able to give themselves and their families a good life, everyone wants to be happy. That's it, what other justification is needed? Most of these industries might have been born from a need but their whole goal as they develop is to get society to depend on them so that the need is not covered by better (less impactful) industries.

imgabe 4y ago
You could ask the same thing about alcohol, or gambling. But people have been doing these things since before there were industries for them, so there’s apparently something besides marketing that causes humans to want those things. The better way to combat these “evil” industries would be to fulfill that need as well or better in less destructive ways, making the industry obsolete.

sterlind 4y ago

Re: Purdue, that's easy. Painkillers make living with intense chronic pain bearable. Oxycontin was a great pain med for a lot of people. A friend of mine has a mangled spinal cord, and she's severely crippled by the pain alone. But then the opioid crisis happened, they forced doctors to stop prescribing long-term opioids and now her liver's failing from the sheer stress of her writhing in pain constantly. So if I'd worked at Purdue, I'd think of the patients, rather than the junkies, the way you think of the cafeteria rather than lung cancer.