3 ms·

I’d love to see that study and see if it takes into account how much energy was expended constructing the car vs the bike and the roadway required for the car.

I’d love to see that study and see if it takes into account how much energy was expended constructing the car vs the bike and the roadway required for the car. CO2/Mile on a basis of marginal energy invested for each extra mile is not a valid comparison.

hot_gril 4y ago
https://keith.seas.harvard.edu/blog/climate-impacts-biking-vs-driving https://keith.seas.harvard.edu/blog/climate-impacts-biking-v... It doesn't count the manufacturing of each. It's still a valid comparison without it, cause most Americans who have a bike probably also have a car that they need for trips that aren't bike-able, and also cause it helps to separate fixed and marginal costs anyway.
- Xylakant 4y ago
  There are other places I. The world where this is not true. For example, more than 50% of all households within this S-Bahn ring in Berlin (let’s call that the extended center) do not own a car. The bike may also replace a second or third car. Not counting the cost of manufacture is just sloppy. They also picked a car that is twice as efficient as the average car for comparison and the most meat-heavy fiery possible (essentially meat only). That’s interesting as a though experiment, but not as a basis for policy- which is exactly what they state in their preface.
  - hot_gril 4y ago
    Yeah, it's not for policy, otherwise it'd have to target a particular jurisdiction too. It's for individual interpretation. If you eat a lot of meat and own a car and a bike already, maybe think about biking more as a healthy exercise than a way to help the environment, or think of meat as a bigger problem for it.
LunaSea 4y ago
The roadway is also required for bikes.
- occz 4y ago
  Paved bicycle paths require a fraction of the size and an even smaller fraction of the upkeep, on account of bicycles being so light, and road tear being an approximate function of weight to the fourth power.
  - LunaSea 4y ago
    If you want everyone to bike, you'll need larger bikeways than what exists now. Also, you'll still need the roads for logistics.
    - occz 4y ago
      Bicycle infrastructure accomodates far more people per area of infrastructure, as cars scale really poorly while bicycles scale really well. My point about maintenance also still stands.

hot_gril 4y ago

https://keith.seas.harvard.edu/blog/climate-impacts-biking-vs-driving https://keith.seas.harvard.edu/blog/climate-impacts-biking-v... It doesn't count the manufacturing of each. It's still a valid comparison without it, cause most Americans who have a bike probably also have a car that they need for trips that aren't bike-able, and also cause it helps to separate fixed and marginal costs anyway.

Xylakant 4y ago
There are other places I. The world where this is not true. For example, more than 50% of all households within this S-Bahn ring in Berlin (let’s call that the extended center) do not own a car. The bike may also replace a second or third car. Not counting the cost of manufacture is just sloppy. They also picked a car that is twice as efficient as the average car for comparison and the most meat-heavy fiery possible (essentially meat only). That’s interesting as a though experiment, but not as a basis for policy- which is exactly what they state in their preface.
- hot_gril 4y ago
  Yeah, it's not for policy, otherwise it'd have to target a particular jurisdiction too. It's for individual interpretation. If you eat a lot of meat and own a car and a bike already, maybe think about biking more as a healthy exercise than a way to help the environment, or think of meat as a bigger problem for it.

LunaSea 4y ago

The roadway is also required for bikes.

occz 4y ago
Paved bicycle paths require a fraction of the size and an even smaller fraction of the upkeep, on account of bicycles being so light, and road tear being an approximate function of weight to the fourth power.
- LunaSea 4y ago
  If you want everyone to bike, you'll need larger bikeways than what exists now. Also, you'll still need the roads for logistics.
  - occz 4y ago
    Bicycle infrastructure accomodates far more people per area of infrastructure, as cars scale really poorly while bicycles scale really well. My point about maintenance also still stands.