6 ms·

It’s time to bring back old hardware sitting in closets as while they may be obsolete from a performance perspective they are ahead in terms of privacy. Let’s s

It’s time to bring back old hardware sitting in closets as while they may be obsolete from a performance perspective they are ahead in terms of privacy. Let’s stop stripping old hardware support out of the Linux kernel and keep distros for old hardware alive.

amatecha 4y ago
done exactly this - reading & commenting from an old ThinkPad running OpenBSD. I don't buy new computers, I buy old ones from craigslist (in fact, multiple, so I can use the same system & compatible parts for many years to come). :)
- autoexec 4y ago
  > reading & commenting from an old ThinkPad running OpenBSD How old? IBM Thinkpads were often decent enough that I'd pick one up if I saw a good deal, but Lenovo makes them now and they've got a long history of pre-installing malware and backdoors in their products (often in exchange for money). It's a shame, because I hear they play very well with linux. I'm not sure a Lenovo device would be any safer than the latest processors
  - caned 4y ago
    > they've got a long history of pre-installing malware and backdoors in their products (often in exchange for money) Source for this?
    - jamesy0ung 4y ago
      Superfish, https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/product_security/ps500035-superfish-vulnerability https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/product_security/ps500035-s...
      - midasuni 4y ago
        That looks like some windows malware. All OeMs bundle that sort of stuff in windows, I think Microsoft does too.
        autoexec 4y ago
        Pretty much all OEMs preinstall adware. Microsoft infects their own OS with crapware. They don't all ship with malware infested UEFI so that even reinstalling your OS won't remove the bloatware they installed. Also Lenovo has, multiple times now, installed adware on systems that seriously compromised the security of the user and/or the device. Adware is bad, remote code execution is much worse.
        midasuni 4y ago
        For what I read superfish is some crap spyware with a root certificate that’s wiped the minute you boot the machine from your usb install disk. Any luck is to uefi based malware? (Personally I prefer a nice old fashioned bios)
    - autoexec 4y ago
      I'd start here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lenovo#Security_and_privacy_incidents https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lenovo#Security_and_privacy_in... Superfish was bad enough, but once the public became aware that the malware existed and was so insecure that it made their devices vulnerable to be hacked Lenovo provided people with a fix to remove the malware, but it left the security vulnerability that the malware introduced to the system in place leaving everyone to think they solved the problem when they were still vulnerable. People had to track down news articles and social media posts for information on how to correct the problem until Lenovo updated their instructions. (https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/02/how-to-remove-the-superfish-malware-what-lenovo-doesnt-tell-you/ https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/02/how-t...) Further reading: https://www.eset.com/int/about/newsroom/press-releases/research/eset-research-discovers-vulnerabilities-in-lenovo-laptops-exposing-users-to-risk-of-uefi-malware-ins/ https://www.eset.com/int/about/newsroom/press-releases/resea... https://www.osnews.com/story/30736/lenovo-companies-working-in-china-install-local-backdoors/ https://www.osnews.com/story/30736/lenovo-companies-working-... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18025645 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18025645 https://www.theregister.com/2022/07/14/lenovo_uefi_vuln/ https://www.theregister.com/2022/07/14/lenovo_uefi_vuln/ https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/lenovo-discovers-and-removes-backdoor-in-networking-switches/ https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/lenovo-discov... https://wccftech.com/lenovo-fingerprint-scanner-hardcoded-password/ https://wccftech.com/lenovo-fingerprint-scanner-hardcoded-pa... https://grahamcluley.com/lenovo-used-12345678-hard-coded-password-shareit-windows/ https://grahamcluley.com/lenovo-used-12345678-hard-coded-pas...
- nyanpasu64 4y ago
  I've heard stories of Thinkpads with UEFI-level rootkits, flashed a modified UEFI myself (though my edits didn't achieve what I set out to do), and read about white-hat exploits putting keyloggers on the EC (power/keyboard controller): https://hackaday.com/2021/07/20/extracting-the-wifi-firmware-and-putting-back-a-keylogger/ https://hackaday.com/2021/07/20/extracting-the-wifi-firmware.... I wouldn't fully trust used computers, to the extent I'd trust a Precursor, single-tasking microcontroller, or pre-2000 game console.
- anthk 4y ago
  OpenBSD Intel Atom n270+1GB RAM netbook user there, among others. Lariza as the big webkit2gtk4 browser, Links and Lynx as normal browser, with media bound to mpv+yt-dlp and nsxiv. MuPDF and a pipe with einfo -pp | lynx... | less for ebooks. ImageMagick, FFMPEG, sox. C, Perl for programming. Bitlbee and Swirc for multi IM chat, sfeed for RSS news and podcasts, slrn for Usenet news. A slightly hacked PCSX4ALL emulator (PSX) plus Mednafen for retrogaming among Slashem, BSDGames and Frotz for IF games. Who said slow? OK, no Google Earth but I can use some TCL/TK based OSM map viewer from the TkIMG demos, and no Wine to play the games for that era. But, meh, I only get GL 1.4, not enough for proper DirectX9 translation (GL 2.1 it's the true basic DX9->GL mapping), so I've got lots of libre alternatives from https://osgameclones.com https://osgameclones.com and a custom ScummVM compiled from ports with --enable-all-engines added to the configure script so I can play games from the Apple II era, passing thru Ultima IV, Maniac Mansion, Broken Sword up to Blade Runner and, soon, Sanitarium. People understimate its old machines...

amatecha 4y ago

done exactly this - reading & commenting from an old ThinkPad running OpenBSD. I don't buy new computers, I buy old ones from craigslist (in fact, multiple, so I can use the same system & compatible parts for many years to come). :)

autoexec 4y ago
> reading & commenting from an old ThinkPad running OpenBSD How old? IBM Thinkpads were often decent enough that I'd pick one up if I saw a good deal, but Lenovo makes them now and they've got a long history of pre-installing malware and backdoors in their products (often in exchange for money). It's a shame, because I hear they play very well with linux. I'm not sure a Lenovo device would be any safer than the latest processors
- caned 4y ago
  > they've got a long history of pre-installing malware and backdoors in their products (often in exchange for money) Source for this?
  - jamesy0ung 4y ago
    Superfish, https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/product_security/ps500035-superfish-vulnerability https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/product_security/ps500035-s...
    - midasuni 4y ago
      That looks like some windows malware. All OeMs bundle that sort of stuff in windows, I think Microsoft does too.
      - autoexec 4y ago
        Pretty much all OEMs preinstall adware. Microsoft infects their own OS with crapware. They don't all ship with malware infested UEFI so that even reinstalling your OS won't remove the bloatware they installed. Also Lenovo has, multiple times now, installed adware on systems that seriously compromised the security of the user and/or the device. Adware is bad, remote code execution is much worse.
        midasuni 4y ago
        For what I read superfish is some crap spyware with a root certificate that’s wiped the minute you boot the machine from your usb install disk. Any luck is to uefi based malware? (Personally I prefer a nice old fashioned bios)
  - autoexec 4y ago
    I'd start here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lenovo#Security_and_privacy_incidents https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lenovo#Security_and_privacy_in... Superfish was bad enough, but once the public became aware that the malware existed and was so insecure that it made their devices vulnerable to be hacked Lenovo provided people with a fix to remove the malware, but it left the security vulnerability that the malware introduced to the system in place leaving everyone to think they solved the problem when they were still vulnerable. People had to track down news articles and social media posts for information on how to correct the problem until Lenovo updated their instructions. (https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/02/how-to-remove-the-superfish-malware-what-lenovo-doesnt-tell-you/ https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/02/how-t...) Further reading: https://www.eset.com/int/about/newsroom/press-releases/research/eset-research-discovers-vulnerabilities-in-lenovo-laptops-exposing-users-to-risk-of-uefi-malware-ins/ https://www.eset.com/int/about/newsroom/press-releases/resea... https://www.osnews.com/story/30736/lenovo-companies-working-in-china-install-local-backdoors/ https://www.osnews.com/story/30736/lenovo-companies-working-... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18025645 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18025645 https://www.theregister.com/2022/07/14/lenovo_uefi_vuln/ https://www.theregister.com/2022/07/14/lenovo_uefi_vuln/ https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/lenovo-discovers-and-removes-backdoor-in-networking-switches/ https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/lenovo-discov... https://wccftech.com/lenovo-fingerprint-scanner-hardcoded-password/ https://wccftech.com/lenovo-fingerprint-scanner-hardcoded-pa... https://grahamcluley.com/lenovo-used-12345678-hard-coded-password-shareit-windows/ https://grahamcluley.com/lenovo-used-12345678-hard-coded-pas...
nyanpasu64 4y ago
I've heard stories of Thinkpads with UEFI-level rootkits, flashed a modified UEFI myself (though my edits didn't achieve what I set out to do), and read about white-hat exploits putting keyloggers on the EC (power/keyboard controller): https://hackaday.com/2021/07/20/extracting-the-wifi-firmware-and-putting-back-a-keylogger/ https://hackaday.com/2021/07/20/extracting-the-wifi-firmware.... I wouldn't fully trust used computers, to the extent I'd trust a Precursor, single-tasking microcontroller, or pre-2000 game console.
anthk 4y ago
OpenBSD Intel Atom n270+1GB RAM netbook user there, among others. Lariza as the big webkit2gtk4 browser, Links and Lynx as normal browser, with media bound to mpv+yt-dlp and nsxiv. MuPDF and a pipe with einfo -pp | lynx... | less for ebooks. ImageMagick, FFMPEG, sox. C, Perl for programming. Bitlbee and Swirc for multi IM chat, sfeed for RSS news and podcasts, slrn for Usenet news. A slightly hacked PCSX4ALL emulator (PSX) plus Mednafen for retrogaming among Slashem, BSDGames and Frotz for IF games. Who said slow? OK, no Google Earth but I can use some TCL/TK based OSM map viewer from the TkIMG demos, and no Wine to play the games for that era. But, meh, I only get GL 1.4, not enough for proper DirectX9 translation (GL 2.1 it's the true basic DX9->GL mapping), so I've got lots of libre alternatives from https://osgameclones.com https://osgameclones.com and a custom ScummVM compiled from ports with --enable-all-engines added to the configure script so I can play games from the Apple II era, passing thru Ultima IV, Maniac Mansion, Broken Sword up to Blade Runner and, soon, Sanitarium. People understimate its old machines...