6 ms·

Now that the rotten things have been banned, I can tell my story without fear of being locked up. I went through a body scanner on a trip within Europe about a

by wbhart 15y ago

Now that the rotten things have been banned, I can tell my story without fear of being locked up. I went through a body scanner on a trip within Europe about a year or two ago. There was no random selection, they were just forcing everyone through the machine (I assume it was an x-ray but didn't actually have time to check). This machine was of the variety that did not have an operator viewing the images in a private room, but the operator standing at the machine had a display mounted on the machine itself (some parts of Europe are much less fussy about nudity). When I went through, the image was indistinct but showed "concealments" all over me (I was also permitted to see the image). The guy looked concerned and started to pat me down so he could figure out what these "concealments" were. After twenty seconds or so it was clear to him that I had no concealments and he confidently pronounced that the machines actually don't work if you are sweaty. Hilariously, a full bottle of water went through the (bag) X-ray machine unnoticed in my backpack. I pointed it out and they were kind enough to accept that I had left it in my bag accidentally and let me have it confiscated instead of what ever else it is they do with someone who has bottles of dangerous liquids like water in their bags. Since that humiliating experience I have travelled by plane in Europe as little as possible, taking the Eurostar train wherever practical. I do not travel to the US any more for any reason. I am delighted the machines are unsafe and have been banned, but naturally I believe they should have been banned on grounds of them being ineffective and an unnecessary invasion of personal privacy. Edit: I reviewed the information here: http://www.jaunted.com/story/2010/1/5/163631/3181/travel/Full-Body+Scanners+101%3A+The+Two+Types+and+How+They+Work http://www.jaunted.com/story/2010/1/5/163631/3181/travel/Ful... and I do not know which type of machine it was. Frankly, it doesn't match the description of either. There were no rotating walls, it did not take 40s, yet it was not a vertical wall. Unfortunate. It would have been nice to know.

apr 15y ago
Out of curiosity, why did you point out that the bottle of water had gone through their machine unnoticed. It was unnoticed, right?
- wbhart 15y ago
  Because they asked me whether there were any liquids in my bag before I put it into the scanner. I initially answered no. When the bag was already through the scanner I remembered I hadn't actually taken the bottle out of the bag. I hadn't collected the bag yet though. So what is a man supposed to do?
  - mahyarm 15y ago
    People forget water bottles all the time. They are very used to it. All that happens is that you get the standard extra detail check (they're polite), it takes 3 minutes, usually with just the missed water bottle in question or they just throw it away or just tell you to remember next time.
    - noduerme 15y ago
      I had to answer (2 years ago) for a 6-inch razor sharp knife in my overnight bag at a regional airport in the States. I forgot it was in a pocket of my bag, which was an old carrier I hadn't emptied out since art school. Surprisingly, all they did was take the knife and let me through =) It does show it's more important for them not to look like individual idiots than it is to protect the safety of people on the plane. The ol' Jerry Sandusky locker room mentality, eh? Just horsin' around? TSA are douchebags, and I hope that agency was created as a convenient way to find all the dumbest people in our society so we could stand them next to devices that would irradiate their testicles and keep 'em from having kids. Oh snap, it was =)
      - wbhart 15y ago
        Your sense of humour probably tipped them off about the knife, not the techonogical equipment or the enhanced grope test. I'm sure they were very threatened by meeting a socially well-adjusted person. The bottle of water didn't cause me any trouble in Europe, but I had real fear after having previously had a terrible run in the US both with the Thug Squad and Immigration. I don't know if you have a doctorate, but I can tell you that this is a big red flag. As I said above I don't travel to the US for any reason any more. I once saw a girl who couldn't have been more than 16 who had collapsed on the floor in tears because of what I assume was the abusive verbal treatment she had received. She was literally dragged right across the floor of the room by some fat prick holstering no less than two weapons. She was clearly frightened out of her brain. I was then singled out for obnoxious treatment by a different troll for absolutely no reason whatever. I made it through the barrage of verbal accusations and threats, but shook for about an hour afterwards. You just know that you cannot so much as raise your shoulders or flare your nostrils without having the moron escalate his creative fiction and possibly deport you. They love that sense of power they get. You have to stand there submissively and not let them get a rise out of you all the while insisting that they are wrong. In contrast, I have never had an issue with immigration or the equivalent of the TSA in any other country. I did once get a secondary interview at immigration in Europe by some shadowy figure from some secret service. It was as bizarre as you might imagine. He had the emblazoned vest, the earpiece, the whole kit, and he asked me random questions about my past. But it was polite, short, not at all frightening and it was pretty clear that he wasn't there looking for people like me. (Who knows what these people get up to. I'd not seen them at an airport before and have never seen them there since.)
grannyg00se 15y ago
What is it about your post that would have you fearing being locked up? And what about the experience was humiliating? Your story sounds like a basic, routine scenario.
- wbhart 15y ago
  I was not fearing being locked up for anything that happened that day as I clearly did nothing wrong. And there was no requirement for me to subsequently report the problems with this technology as the operators had that duty themselves, being clearly aware of it. But there may have been a requirement for me to not report the problem publicly myself as the machines were presumably still in operation. Obviously "locked up" is a hyperbole, but presumably it's never worth the trouble to find out by how much. I personally find it humiliating to have a nudiscan in public, especially when it then falsely identifies me as having "concealments". Anyway the way this machine was being operated would contravene the new rules, and for good reason.
- ataggart 15y ago
  That a strip-search is "basic" or "routine" is orthogonal to it being a humiliating violation of ones person.
  - grannyg00se 15y ago
    Who said anything about a strip search? Wait a second....someone told this person to take off their clothes, then proceeded to physically touch them and probe their orifices searching for contraband? I don't think it's reasonable to compare what happened with a strip search. And I don't see how what happened is all that humiliating, though I get the sense I'm probably just not as sensitive as many others. I find the security measures annoying and frustratingly misguided, but not humiliating.
    - ataggart 15y ago
      You seem to be confusing a strip search with a body cavity search. These machines are an electronic means of performing a strip search. There should be nothing controversial in that claim.

by wbhart 15y ago

apr 15y ago

Out of curiosity, why did you point out that the bottle of water had gone through their machine unnoticed. It was unnoticed, right?

wbhart 15y ago
Because they asked me whether there were any liquids in my bag before I put it into the scanner. I initially answered no. When the bag was already through the scanner I remembered I hadn't actually taken the bottle out of the bag. I hadn't collected the bag yet though. So what is a man supposed to do?
- mahyarm 15y ago
  People forget water bottles all the time. They are very used to it. All that happens is that you get the standard extra detail check (they're polite), it takes 3 minutes, usually with just the missed water bottle in question or they just throw it away or just tell you to remember next time.
  - noduerme 15y ago
    I had to answer (2 years ago) for a 6-inch razor sharp knife in my overnight bag at a regional airport in the States. I forgot it was in a pocket of my bag, which was an old carrier I hadn't emptied out since art school. Surprisingly, all they did was take the knife and let me through =) It does show it's more important for them not to look like individual idiots than it is to protect the safety of people on the plane. The ol' Jerry Sandusky locker room mentality, eh? Just horsin' around? TSA are douchebags, and I hope that agency was created as a convenient way to find all the dumbest people in our society so we could stand them next to devices that would irradiate their testicles and keep 'em from having kids. Oh snap, it was =)
    - wbhart 15y ago
      Your sense of humour probably tipped them off about the knife, not the techonogical equipment or the enhanced grope test. I'm sure they were very threatened by meeting a socially well-adjusted person. The bottle of water didn't cause me any trouble in Europe, but I had real fear after having previously had a terrible run in the US both with the Thug Squad and Immigration. I don't know if you have a doctorate, but I can tell you that this is a big red flag. As I said above I don't travel to the US for any reason any more. I once saw a girl who couldn't have been more than 16 who had collapsed on the floor in tears because of what I assume was the abusive verbal treatment she had received. She was literally dragged right across the floor of the room by some fat prick holstering no less than two weapons. She was clearly frightened out of her brain. I was then singled out for obnoxious treatment by a different troll for absolutely no reason whatever. I made it through the barrage of verbal accusations and threats, but shook for about an hour afterwards. You just know that you cannot so much as raise your shoulders or flare your nostrils without having the moron escalate his creative fiction and possibly deport you. They love that sense of power they get. You have to stand there submissively and not let them get a rise out of you all the while insisting that they are wrong. In contrast, I have never had an issue with immigration or the equivalent of the TSA in any other country. I did once get a secondary interview at immigration in Europe by some shadowy figure from some secret service. It was as bizarre as you might imagine. He had the emblazoned vest, the earpiece, the whole kit, and he asked me random questions about my past. But it was polite, short, not at all frightening and it was pretty clear that he wasn't there looking for people like me. (Who knows what these people get up to. I'd not seen them at an airport before and have never seen them there since.)

grannyg00se 15y ago

What is it about your post that would have you fearing being locked up? And what about the experience was humiliating? Your story sounds like a basic, routine scenario.

wbhart 15y ago
I was not fearing being locked up for anything that happened that day as I clearly did nothing wrong. And there was no requirement for me to subsequently report the problems with this technology as the operators had that duty themselves, being clearly aware of it. But there may have been a requirement for me to not report the problem publicly myself as the machines were presumably still in operation. Obviously "locked up" is a hyperbole, but presumably it's never worth the trouble to find out by how much. I personally find it humiliating to have a nudiscan in public, especially when it then falsely identifies me as having "concealments". Anyway the way this machine was being operated would contravene the new rules, and for good reason.
ataggart 15y ago
That a strip-search is "basic" or "routine" is orthogonal to it being a humiliating violation of ones person.
- grannyg00se 15y ago
  Who said anything about a strip search? Wait a second....someone told this person to take off their clothes, then proceeded to physically touch them and probe their orifices searching for contraband? I don't think it's reasonable to compare what happened with a strip search. And I don't see how what happened is all that humiliating, though I get the sense I'm probably just not as sensitive as many others. I find the security measures annoying and frustratingly misguided, but not humiliating.
  - ataggart 15y ago
    You seem to be confusing a strip search with a body cavity search. These machines are an electronic means of performing a strip search. There should be nothing controversial in that claim.