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Right now we use Stripe (mostly because it's the the most rock solid choice for payments) -- we don't ask for name or email, though of course Stripe could know

Right now we use Stripe (mostly because it's the the most rock solid choice for payments) -- we don't ask for name or email, though of course Stripe could know that as a card processor. But our approach goes back to decoupling human identity from network identity -- what that payment says is that the holder of that card is a subscriber of the service but not, for example, what network ID you got.

unknownaccount 4y ago
Why not accept cryptocurrency?
NoImmatureAdHom 4y ago
Thanks for working on this, I can't wait to give you my money. It seems like you're misreading a key market segment if you don't offer cryptocurrency payments (particularly Monero).
sneak 4y ago
Your somewhat evasive answers don't really instill confidence. The answer is no, you cannot. Payment cards are PII.
- barathr 4y ago
  I don't see what was evasive, happy to answer in more detail if there's something you're seeing not answered above. We use Stripe as a credit card processor -- so we have what Stripe's (very well documented) APIs provide. That reveals that you purchased the service, but we don't know anything about the network identity you have nor your Internet usage, because architecturally we don't have that information. I understand that revealing that information to Stripe may not be acceptable -- not sure what to say to that. We've gotten requests for other forms of payments and we can consider it, but we don't support anything other than credit cards at the moment. (There are credit cards that aren't linked to a person, if that's a better option.)
  - nibbleshifter 4y ago
    > There are credit cards that aren't linked to a person My desire to know more intensifies.
    - selectodude 4y ago
      https://www.amexgiftcard.com/ https://www.amexgiftcard.com/ Go to the grocery store, buy with cash, you're good to go.
      - sneak 4y ago
        No. All payment cards in the United States require strong government identity and KYC, per US federal law. To activate these cards you must provide identity information. Providing false information is a crime.
        jjulius 4y ago
        >No. No. Gift cards can be purchased in-person in the US, with cash. Said gift cards are activated at the register upon purchase. These can then be gifted to someone else, and further activation (or registering your personal information with the card) is not required. Edit: I just checked the Visa gift card issuer's site for a card I have (and never had to activate or provide personal information to), and for shopping online it just says: >In the Payment Method section, enter the Card information as you would a credit or debit card. In the Billing Address section, fill in your name and address. So when I check out online, I can enter any information that I like, presumably as long as it ties back to a valid address of some kind - there is zero effort on the part of the card issuer to verify that I am who I say I am. I would only need a PIN when making purchases with it as a debit card in-person. I should make it clear that I'm not saying that providing false information is legal, just that the point about being required to provide "strong government identity" to activate gift cards has been false for a long time.
        samatman 4y ago
        Nonsense and balderdash sneak, I can walk into any grocery store which isn't fancy and buy a hundred buck's worth of Visa with cash. You said this with remarkable confidence and were dead wrong. You should reflect on that.
nibbleshifter 4y ago
Once you accept some kind of privacy coin (monero) I'll be delighted to buy a years service upfront. I imagine many others will be in the same position. Obviously taking crypto will mean upfront prepayment of accounts (like prepaid mobile credit) instead of monthly billing and will require some reworking.
- preisschild 4y ago
  Not accepting Monero and not having the app open source and on F-Droid are also why I won't even think about subscribing to this service for now. For a privacy product this should have been there at the start.
zer0k3wl 4y ago
Do you accept visa/mc/amex giftcards? Stripe merchants can opt to decline these cards.

unknownaccount 4y ago

Why not accept cryptocurrency?

NoImmatureAdHom 4y ago

Thanks for working on this, I can't wait to give you my money. It seems like you're misreading a key market segment if you don't offer cryptocurrency payments (particularly Monero).

sneak 4y ago

Your somewhat evasive answers don't really instill confidence. The answer is no, you cannot. Payment cards are PII.

barathr 4y ago
I don't see what was evasive, happy to answer in more detail if there's something you're seeing not answered above. We use Stripe as a credit card processor -- so we have what Stripe's (very well documented) APIs provide. That reveals that you purchased the service, but we don't know anything about the network identity you have nor your Internet usage, because architecturally we don't have that information. I understand that revealing that information to Stripe may not be acceptable -- not sure what to say to that. We've gotten requests for other forms of payments and we can consider it, but we don't support anything other than credit cards at the moment. (There are credit cards that aren't linked to a person, if that's a better option.)
- nibbleshifter 4y ago
  > There are credit cards that aren't linked to a person My desire to know more intensifies.
  - selectodude 4y ago
    https://www.amexgiftcard.com/ https://www.amexgiftcard.com/ Go to the grocery store, buy with cash, you're good to go.
    - sneak 4y ago
      No. All payment cards in the United States require strong government identity and KYC, per US federal law. To activate these cards you must provide identity information. Providing false information is a crime.
      - jjulius 4y ago
        >No. No. Gift cards can be purchased in-person in the US, with cash. Said gift cards are activated at the register upon purchase. These can then be gifted to someone else, and further activation (or registering your personal information with the card) is not required. Edit: I just checked the Visa gift card issuer's site for a card I have (and never had to activate or provide personal information to), and for shopping online it just says: >In the Payment Method section, enter the Card information as you would a credit or debit card. In the Billing Address section, fill in your name and address. So when I check out online, I can enter any information that I like, presumably as long as it ties back to a valid address of some kind - there is zero effort on the part of the card issuer to verify that I am who I say I am. I would only need a PIN when making purchases with it as a debit card in-person. I should make it clear that I'm not saying that providing false information is legal, just that the point about being required to provide "strong government identity" to activate gift cards has been false for a long time.
      - samatman 4y ago
        Nonsense and balderdash sneak, I can walk into any grocery store which isn't fancy and buy a hundred buck's worth of Visa with cash. You said this with remarkable confidence and were dead wrong. You should reflect on that.

nibbleshifter 4y ago

Once you accept some kind of privacy coin (monero) I'll be delighted to buy a years service upfront. I imagine many others will be in the same position. Obviously taking crypto will mean upfront prepayment of accounts (like prepaid mobile credit) instead of monthly billing and will require some reworking.

preisschild 4y ago
Not accepting Monero and not having the app open source and on F-Droid are also why I won't even think about subscribing to this service for now. For a privacy product this should have been there at the start.

zer0k3wl 4y ago

Do you accept visa/mc/amex giftcards? Stripe merchants can opt to decline these cards.