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The Kindle is inexpensive, has great support, has a huge library (open to non-US people with non-US credit cards), and you could just email a MOBI to it (which

• qwerty456127 4y ago
  AFAIK Kindle shows you ads and can occasionally delete a book from your library. Isn't it so?
  • chrisseaton 4y ago
    > Kindle shows you ads Never seen an advert on my Kindle.
    • actionfromafar 4y ago
      I turned off WiFi on mine because I was too annoyed by ads.
      • chrisseaton 4y ago
        Where do they show up? Never seen one.
        • sofixa 4y ago
          There's a specific, cheaper version (10 euros cheaper in France) that has ads in.
        • 5e92cb50239222b 4y ago
          An ad replaces the "screen saver" when you unlock the device (until you swipe it away), and there's a small banner at the bottom of the book list in the main menu. You probably bought a more expensive version with no ads. They can also be removed later for a small fee, or you can simply never enable wi-fi and there will be no ads at all.
      • deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
  • dizhn 4y ago
    It shows ads if you buy the cheaper ad supported version. (They even removed the ads for me because Amazon did not sell books in my country)
  • gambiting 4y ago
    If you buy a kindle that is specifically advertised as having ads(and therefore being sold for less money), then yes, you will get ads. If you don't want them, buy the ad free version. And the deletion from your library happened...once? Over millions of titles available?
    • deelly 4y ago
      Honestly, one time is enough.
      • gambiting 4y ago
        Really? I guess you don't use Steam either then?
        • Maken 4y ago
          When Steam removes a game, it means they no longer sell it, but they don't remove it from your computer nor stop you from downloading it if you already adquired it.
          • gambiting 4y ago
            Typically, yes - but they have also removed games from user libraries, preventing them from ever downloading the game again - exactly like Amazon has done in that one instance with an eBook. https://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2013/12/30/steam-removes-game-order-of-war-challenge-from-user-libraries/?sh=27f537692a29 https://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2013/12/30/steam-remov... My point is - OP said that "once is enough" - well by that metric, I'm asking if they also don't use steam, because Steam has done exactly this at least once in the past.
      • deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
    • Iolaum 4y ago
      The title that got removed was 1984, you can't make this stuff up https://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/18/technology/companies/18amazon.html https://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/18/technology/companies/18am...
  • PaulRobinson 4y ago
    My Kindle doesn't show ads, because I didn't buy the version that shows ads. I have never had a book deleted from my Kindle by Amazon. There was a single instance of a couple of George Orwell's books being removed from user devices in July 2009. Customers had the purchase price they paid refunded. It was done because the company selling those books didn't actually have the rights to sell them. Afterwards, Jeff Bezos apologised and described it as "stupid, thoughtless, and painfully out of line with our principles". It is therefore unlikely to happen again. Given the commercial structure of Amazon e-Books, does it make sense to buy something that gives you as a reader more rights (e.g. when you die)? Perhaps. But I know what I've got into, so has every other Kindle owner on Earth. You do you, but your stated premise against Kindle is at best a little inaccurate and outdated, and at worst comes across perhaps a little hyperbolic.
    • brokenkebab2 4y ago
      >Afterwards, Jeff Bezos apologised [...] It is therefore unlikely to happen again. If it's still technically possible (it is), it will happen again. It's implemented to be used, even if occasionally. And mere existence of this feature is a clear declaration, you don't own it, you rent it. Many people may find it acceptable, taking other circumstances, but it's a big bold minus.
      • appletrotter 4y ago
        Just pirate your books if you’re so concerned.
        • brokenkebab2 4y ago
          I'm concerned by the fact that Amazon can delete files from a device I bought. How is this related to your comment? I don't see
    • ectopod 4y ago
      I bought a version that didn't show ads but I did a hardware reset after a few years. Now it does. Since then they've also added an annoying carousel of sponsored apps to the home screen. I've never bought an ebook from Amazon so at least I can easily move to something else when the kindle finally packs in.
• spacehunt 4y ago
  Kobo has built-in Overdrive, Dropbox and Pocket support on the device itself, which Kindle lacks.
  • Namari 4y ago
    Pocket is the reason I chose the Kobo, how can the others miss that feature, it's not like people just read books nowadays.
    • k1m 4y ago
      While not exactly like Pocket, there are services that can send web articles to your Kindle. I work on one called Push to Kindle: https://www.fivefilters.org/push-to-kindle/ https://www.fivefilters.org/push-to-kindle/
      • Namari 4y ago
        that's a good idea, you should try to implement some sort of extension to make it easier
        • k1m 4y ago
          Thanks. We already have extensions for most popular browsers: Chrome, Firefox, Safari, Edge. Links at the URL above. As well as an Android and iOS app. Chrome extension here: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/push-to-kindle/pnaiinchjaonopoejhknmgjingcnaloc https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/push-to-kindle/pna...
  • sandos 4y ago
    The overdrive and epub support was the reason for me buying the kobo even after already owning a kindle. Still worth it just for the overdrive support.
  • maratc 4y ago
    Kobo only needs it to support transfers, and because it lacks emailing. If I want Overdrive, Dropbox and Pocket support, I have a smartphone for that.
• biztos 4y ago
  I used a Kobo for a long time and I just bought a Kindle, because it was so hard to get articles on the Kobo. They stopped supporting direct file transfers from Mac, so I was left with Pocket, and Pocket didn't think a lot of what I tried to save was "articles." So far I find that for my purposes, the Kindle is way easier to get content onto, and there's quite a bit of content I want that I can just buy there, but couldn't buy for Kobo. I hope to not get locked in to the Amazon ecosystem but as of right now, my cheapest-model Kindle is way more useful than my old top-of-the-line Kobo.
  • topbanana 4y ago
    How do you get articles onto your Kindle?
    • biztos 4y ago
      There are a bunch of conversion services, some with browser extensions. But I can also print a page as PDF in A5 format and E-Mail it to myself (you have a dedicated Kindle address at Amazon) with a title of “Convert” and it seems to do a very good job. (A5 because it’s pretty close to the Kindle format and easy to find in the print dialog.)
    • damontal 4y ago
      You can set Instapaper to auto send articles or a digest of articles to your kindle.
  • deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
• whyoh 4y ago
  >Now that Kindle is supporting ePUB... Kindles do not support ePUB. But you can send ePUBs through the Amazon online conversion service now, which wasn't possible in the past.
  • Hitton 4y ago
    And if you are lucky, Amazon will even be able to convert them. About week ago I wanted to test it, I tried it with bunch of epubs from various sources and only about half converted successfully.
    • GekkePrutser 4y ago
      Yeah I often have issues with "fancy quotes" not getting converted correctly if I email an ePub to Kindle. They get converted to HTML entities :( With Calibre it works but it's an annoying extra step. I hope Amazon fix this issue before they officially start supporting ePub.
    • Turing_Machine 4y ago
      Try using epubcheck on those to see where the finger really should be pointed. There are a lot of really crap "epubs" out there. https://www.w3.org/publishing/epubcheck/ https://www.w3.org/publishing/epubcheck/
  • maratc 4y ago
    There's no magic ASIC on the Kobo that transfers the stream of bytes into the stream of pixels; ePub support is in the Kobo software. Amazon now has this support in their software. The fact that the conversion software runs on Kindle servers (and not on the Kindle device) is insignificant to me - what's important is I can have an ePub and can read it on the Kindle.
    • ryukafalz 4y ago
      So long as the server doing that continues to exist.
• Lio 4y ago
  That's not Kindle's only disadvantage. Kobo had distinct features I wanted that no Kindle offered at the time I last purchased. Like a screen big enough to comfortably read PDFs. 10.3" on Kobo Elipsa vs 7" on Kindle. IMHO that makes the Kindle only really useful for fiction. There's also Pocket support for reading offline web articles. Overdrive support so I can borrow books from my local library for free. Free Dropbox syncing without having to email everything when I buy a book from someone that isn't Amazon e.g PragProg, Packt, etc. (Dropbox does support email though if you do want that). In theory I could also use the pen and take written notes on my Elipsa too but it's not a feature I was looking for. The other stuff you mentioned, like Kindle having a large purchasable library, is also true for Kobo right from the homescreen. They're also priced similarly if you match specs and available for same day delivery from Argos in the UK. Finally, I know I could hack my last Kindle but Kobo make that really easy out of the box. Installing Koreader, Plato or anything else is simple even if it's not required for everyday use. So for me it's the other way around. Amazon offers nothing I want that Kobo doesn't have. Different people have different usecases but I don't think I'll go back to a Kindle now I've switched. Kobos are very easy to live with.
  • BSOhealth 4y ago
    Libraries are very important, and Kindle supports borrowing from them (for free): https://help.overdrive.com/en-us/0431.html https://help.overdrive.com/en-us/0431.html
    • multicelled 4y ago
      So does Kobo! https://help.overdrive.com/en-us/9988.html https://help.overdrive.com/en-us/9988.html
    • anuragsoni 4y ago
      So does the kobo (at least in the US). Kobo devices have the overdrive app installed on them and you can search for and borrow library books from within the device.
    • BeetleB 4y ago
      Funny you mention this, because Kindle support for libraries was amongst the last. For a number of years after buying my ereader libraries did not support Kindle. They've supported epub since at least 2010, possibly even before.
• goosedragons 4y ago
  Kobo's are like a stone's throw in price from Kindles. Depending on features/market they can be cheaper and they don't even sell lockscreen ads. The only cheaper Kindle is the awful 800x600 screen one which should have been put to bed years ago. They also have a huge library open to non-US people with non-US credit cards. Kobos are considerably better at formatting text with far more options and are even easier to tweak. I literally could not find a font size I liked when I had a Kindle because the smallest was too small and every other one too big. And Kindle STILL does not support ePub. All Amazon has done is started letting people email epubs to their Kindle and their backend will convert it to an Amazon format. This has conversion warts, means you lose cover support too. You still can't copy an ePub over USB.
  • adam12 4y ago
    Can I ever get a Kobo for $45?
    • goosedragons 4y ago
      I'm pretty sure at some point the Kobo mini was about that at some point... It's not like $45 is the regular price of the Kindle either. Camelcamelcamel has the new base model having it's lowest at $70 and I've seen the Nia for $80 and they are pretty comparable.
• ZeroGravitas 4y ago
  Note if you email MOBI it might get its formatting randomly messed up. https://standardebooks.org/help/how-to-use-our-ebooks#kindle-faq https://standardebooks.org/help/how-to-use-our-ebooks#kindle...
• phpisthebest 4y ago
  >>I don't even see what the Kobo value prop is. It is not amazon encumbered. That is a huge value to many
  • SoftTalker 4y ago
    That's why I bought mine. I don't want to give Amazon any of my money.
  • maratc 4y ago
    I had three readers from Sony (until they exited the business) and one from B&N (until they exited the business), because I didn't want to deal with conversion. Of these still in the business, Amazon looks the least-like to exit soon, and now there's no need to deal with conversion. As most of the books I read are out of copyright anyway, I'm not "encumbering" myself with Amazon in any way, except for buying hardware they made.
    • coder543 4y ago
      > one from B&N (until they exited the business) Did they exit the business? It looks like the Nook Glowlight 4 was released less than a year ago. I don't know a single person in real life with an e-reader other than a Kindle, including myself, so I had to google to see how B&N Nook was doing when you said that, but it still seems to be a thing.
      • maratc 4y ago
        Just checked — they indeed still have one model (not counting special editions in pink) after a hiatus of four years. Without an SD card, sideloading is an issue though.
    • wlonkly 4y ago
      > no need to deal with conversion There is still a need to deal with conversion, but it happens on Amazon servers. Which is convenient, but gives no control over the results (and someone mentioned in another comment that it doesn't even preserve the cover image). The Kindle itself does not natively support ePub. MOBI is being retired to favour AZW3, and Microsoft is moving to ePub.
• levesque 4y ago
  Kobo appears to be an inferior device on most accounts. Both of my Kobo readers have had glitches, required reboots, and at times had a suspiciously low battery life. The first even just stopped working all of a sudden. But all of it was worth it knowing I wouldn't have to support Amazon's walled garden. Now it's mostly down to "do you support Amazon?", and I'm still not sure if I want a Kindle. I'll keep my Kobo H2O until it dies of old age, then we'll see.
  • tiahura 4y ago
    Agreed. I love my kobo’s form factor, but the glitchiness is frustrating. For me, the inaccuracy of the Aura HD’s touch recognition is what causes the most headaches.
    • levesque 4y ago
      Oh right, forgot about touch recognition, that's also a bit off. Needs more strength / pressure than it should. I'm guessing they didn't tune it properly when they made the devices water resistant?
  • giancarlostoro 4y ago
    > required reboots I feel like a FreeBSD guru in the 90s, "YOU REBOOT???" but seriously, I don't recall ever having to reboot my Kindle except the time I tried to open a 500MB PDF and I should of known better.
  • nanomonkey 4y ago
    > Now it's mostly down to "do you support Amazon?" I don't know if this is still the case, but the Kindle used to be a loss leader. So in theory, by purchasing one, using Calibre only and never purchasing ebooks from Amazon, you are causing Amazon to bleed revenue.
    • levesque 4y ago
      Great point!
  • 4y ago
• erispoe 4y ago
  I am tempted to switch to Kobo just for the Pocket app.
• gwbas1c 4y ago
  I really only have three minor gripes about the Kindle ecosystem... (Which is why I like it so much.) 1: The desktop applications don't auto-sync. (I really like reading books on my laptop because it holds the screen at a comfortable angle. This is especially the case when reading while eating or doing something else with my hands.) 2: Sometimes the Android app is buggy, requiring that I reinstall. When I reinstall, I have to re-enter all my preferences. 3: Some of the default settings in the Android app are dumb, like showing popular highlights. I always turn that off as quickly as possible.
  • RuggedPineapple 4y ago
    My biggest issue is Kobo doesn't actually support epub, or at least the modern incarnation. Their reader software is woefully out of date and has terrible epub handling, so to get the features you expect you're back to the Calibre->reader loop you're on with kindle, only instead of converting to AZW3 or KFX you're converting to KePub, Kobo's homegrown version of epub they did instead. You can fix that by installing KOreader which DOES support the current epub format, but that again puts you in the same boat as the kindle (perhaps minus needing to jailbreak it) and the kindle has a much more robust community and support.
    • AlanYx 4y ago
      Kobos do support modern epubs, but for some inexplicable reason, they use their old epub2 renderer licensed from Adobe for all .epub files. You can just rename .epub files to .kepub and force Kobos to use the modern reader code. This gets you a lot better formatting. The catch is that location bookmarking becomes imprecise if you do this rather than use kepubify. It's super weird that they don't just offer the option to run kepubify locally on the device, behind the scenes.
      • RuggedPineapple 4y ago
        This isn't really how it works though. It READS epub3, but only data that are valid epub2 structures is rendered. To get a subset (not even all) of epub3 formatting it needs to be built as a Kepub. You may be able to trick it with the extension, but there is some syntax difference. It really is a conversion if you want anything approaching true epub3 and even then its as mentioned a subset.
• toomuchtodo 4y ago
  The value prop is it’s not controlled by Amazon and the whims of a tech giant. Have we learned nothing?
• dkarl 4y ago
  > I don't even see what the Kobo value prop is Not having to hack the device you supposedly own to avoid having ads as your screensaver? My Kindle is at the bottom of my closet for that reason. I haven't bought another physical e-reader, but if I do, it won't be a Kindle. I didn't want to go through the process of finding up-to-date instructions, waiting for a hack that would install on my hardware and software version, crossing my fingers to do the install, at the end of which I wouldn't even know if it was a victory for me or a victory for them that I was still using their product. So I stopped using it and won't buy another one.
  • vageli 4y ago
    The ad-supported model allows people to buy the kindle for less than the non-ad-supported model. AFAIK you can pay a one-time fee and remove them, or buy the non-ad-supported version in the first place.
    • dkarl 4y ago
      There wasn't a choice when I bought mine.
      • coder543 4y ago
        > There wasn't a choice when I bought mine. Ad-supported or not has always been a choice for as long as Amazon has offered ad-supported kindles. I remember making this choice about 10 years ago, and I made this choice about a month ago when I bought my most recent Kindle. If you bought it used or from a reseller, I don't know what to tell you, but Amazon gave you a choice if you bought it from them. As a source, here is an Engadget article from the time when this option was introduced: https://www.engadget.com/2011-04-11-amazon-releases-ad-supported-kindle.html https://www.engadget.com/2011-04-11-amazon-releases-ad-suppo... You can clearly see that Amazon offered the "with Special Offers" version alongside the versions without "Special Offers". The ad-supported version was discounted by $25 back then. Nowadays, it appears to be a $20 difference on the Paperwhite.
        • deleted 4y ago
• nixgeek 4y ago
  I’m not incredibly comfortable with Kindle transmitting information on every page turn back to Amazon. Always felt a bit creepy to me. https://www.theverge.com/2020/1/31/21117217/amazon-kindle-tracking-page-turn-taps-e-reader-privacy-policy-security-whispersync https://www.theverge.com/2020/1/31/21117217/amazon-kindle-tr...
  • thebeardisred 4y ago
    In that sense though, it's not much different from an RSS client reporting back to a synchronization server which articles you've read and which you haven't. It would be great to turn it off without resorting to "airplane mode", but it's also been a nice feature which allows me to squeeze in a little bit of reading from my phone when I don't have an e-reader on my person.
• hollandheese 4y ago
  Except Kindle isn't supporting ePub. You can't sideload an ePub on to a Kindle. All you can do is e-mail an ePub to Amazon, and they'll convert it to AZW3 and load that file on to your Kindle. Further the conversion that they do is notoriously bad and often results in unreadable books. So you often have to tweak the ePub files before sending them to get a decent result. Calibre is essential to that process.
  • dont__panic 4y ago
    Notably they don't display book covers for converted epubs in your library -- clearly hamstringing the conversion so folks aren't too tempted to rely on books from external sources. The AZW3 proprietary format is not something I want to struggle with in my day-to-day -- if anything goes wrong, it's a rabbit hole of reverse engineering. I like copying media to my ereader using cables, because sometimes I don't have a solid internet connection or it just feels wasteful to send a bunch of big files over email (if I'm on a tethered or metered internet connection, just sending a couple dozen books is easily in the hundreds of megabytes up and down). Kobos are a much friendlier ecosystem, and are what I recommend to all family members who don't want their device shackled by Amazon. Easy to hook up to local libraries to borrow books on the fly, easy to copy DRM-free ebooks from online stores. I have a Boox tablet myself because I love notetaking in nonfiction books and hand writing my notes in work meetings and journals.